Ehh that's part of it maybe, but I think the main thing is no stable housing or social support networks. Also SO many more women are making the choice to stay single because they are legally able to exist without men and many men haven't risen to the challenge of being worth living with. Regardless, if the gov't offered UBI but only for people with kids, something like $1200 a month + $600 per additional child, no means testing, I think we'd see many more couples with kids.
this post was submitted on 17 Apr 2026
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Chapotraphouse
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Also SO many more women are making the choice to stay single nevause they are legally able to exist without men
There was a user on Hexbear a few years ago who pointed this out as the main reason birth rates have declined. There's people living in worse conditions outside of the US who still have kids. Women have more options in the Imperial Core, so of course they don't want to deal with men or having health problems from giving birth or missing out on their educations/careers or a dozen other reasons. When women don't have to rely on being a mother for citizenship, of course there's a decline in marriages and birth rates!
That person got shouted down and they deleted their account. A lot of he/hims not beating the allegations. I think about that person every time this conversation comes up.
hexbear in general has a problem with shouting down people who take the right position on women's issues
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also 90% of breadwinner jobs now have college side gig pay (at least relative to skyrocketing housing costs and other costs of living)
because they are legally able to exist without men and many men haven't risen to the challenge of being worth living with.
I think it's more the latter than the former. Some people stay together for financial reasons but a majority of couples get together for the wrong reasons, and make a mess out of their domestic units.
I think it's both, or less boomers would've stayed with their abusive husbands. Women couldn't even have their own bank accounts till the 70s in the US. I'm not convinced men have changed, women have just realized they don't have to put up with it.
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Boomers hate literally everything except sitting on a dragon's hoard of capital assets
When you hate everything while having everything. 
I don't have kids because I am a goddamn mess and I don't have enough mental fortitude to subject myself to the terrors of parentage
Which is a shame, because I love kids, kids are great
Until you have to worry about them getting hurt, or sick or in trouble or killed and my life is scary enough as it is
I feel this. I love kids but whenever people ask why I don't have them I just tell them because alcoholism and I can barely keep myself alive.
man, I remember going to the beach one time and me and my sister sat in the living room while my parents fought in the bedroom for the whole weekend. Great lets just stay up here in the condo and not go to the freakin beach at all.
God my mom loved having random crashouts at my dad on vacation.
Don't get me wrong my dad can be an asshole too but I think in her younger years my mom was one of those people who genuinely gets a rush out of drama and conflict and would just find excuses to get into fights about the most random bullshit.
Personally, it just seems like a much bigger decision than society 
makes it out to be
Pretty shocking to realize that babies and kids are barely treated as human to a huge chunk of the population
I think for most it's just really a consequence of the economy plus pregnancy being such body horror shit that IMO you'd have to REALLY want kids for it to be worth it
it's always just been climate change for me personally.
Can't double click this enough. I can't bear the thought of any kids dealing with that shit, let alone one I intentionally bring up.
My reactionary parents definitely soured marriage and parenthood for me. Ethically I barely feel comfortable with conditional pet ownership. Causing CPTSD in a child with a dysfunctional environment would be the most destructive thing I do in my life. Climate change is still my big deciding factor, but I've seen how those power dynamics fail and how the material stressors of both feed into those toxic dynamics. If I can't guarantee I wouldn't fall into the same trap I'm not willing to expose a kid to that risk.
At the same time, it'd be nice to be a positive influence for a kid. I'm not opposed to adopting if I'm in a stable long-term relationship with another communist and own a homestead. That child's environment just has to be a sanctuary from an otherwise dehumanising society.
yea neither of my parents seemed to like me very much lol
my parents actually got along pretty well, but they hated being parents, especially to any kids they had after 1982. The ones born before then get special treatment (still pretty bad all things considered, but they will step up to defend them in court and pay the lawyers,) while the rest of us either fear parenthood or strive to do better... although even then, the habits of our parents are hard to confront/ work through.
imagine their reaction to becoming grandparents -- this went terribly. Well; the special treatment ones are fine, but the other ones not so much. They kind of hated those grandkids. One is an adult now and we both don't speak to those individuals ✌️
It's really trippy to me, because my in-laws are much better parents (low bar, they're still shitty in some ways) and the most recent baby being born is actually being met with happiness and positive anticipation.
My sibling's former in laws are even more discriminating, first kid my sibling had is showered with presents from the in laws, the second kid has largely been ignored.
never really been fiscally stable enough to do it nor have i ever been involved with someone i could imagine taking on that sort of responsibility with. ive met more people trying to co-parent with a shithead than partners or co-parents making it work.
i also took parents at their word about how difficult it is, and that made me more circumspect about evaluating a prospective partner. i have some friends that had kids and all they have to say is how hard it is and how they didn't believe others who went before, when they said the same. kinda lame to think everybody else is just another candyass complainer.
so besides climate change and social collapse, really when i evaluate what i have to contribute to the future of the whole "humans on earth" experiment, my genetics are like not even in the top 10. i always get confused with other people anyway, so the traits are well represented in the population.
half my grandparents were dead before i was born, the other half died not long after. all from natural causes. ive been an educator and like working with kids and young people / teaching. i can steward natural resources to try and make sure there's something left for a family to survive. im cool with that.
maybe if i grew up in a real country that didn't actively try to convert humans into grist for the mill, it would have shaken out some other way, but I'm comfortable with my choices in this context and don't weap for the lost futures of alternative histories.
except the Union of Soviets.
This isn't just a boomer thing, having kids just sucks. The weird pro-natalism / breeding fetish that some dudes on hexbear have only exists because they tacitly assume they will do the usual thing and unload most of the burden of parenthood on their wife.
The weird pro-natalism / breeding fetish that some dudes on hexbear have
Is this talking about something specific or just the fact that hexbear doesn't allow anti-natalist posts?
I've seen people here get extremely weird about this issue. Just look at how this post has blown up. And honestly, i've seen much, much worse than this, outright entitled incel shit like "a society were women routinely choose not to have kids seems threatening to me." Any time birthrates and parenthood come up, people crawl out of the woodworks to start this endless litany of how they'd have tons of kids if material conditions were better and ... i don't know how to say this kindly, it's complete bullshit.
When you look at AES countries, places that had the best childcare in human history, absolute job security, super low costs of living, then no, it doesn't work like that. The DDR is a perfect example. Everybody who has experienced it misses the childcare and education system of the DDR, they had a lot more women in the workforce than west Germany, raising kids was so much safer and easier and they still had lower birthrates than the west. People made a lot of use of the free and easily accessible abortion clinics and honestly, good on them. It's not just economic insecurity that keeps people from having children. A lot of people genuinely do not want this. And given how much women in particular get pressured into seeing motherhood as a necessary condition for a happy and fulfilled life, i think it's still not enough people who choose this.
Hexbears have to get it out of their heads that "anti-natalism" is a rightwing stance. In fact, "anti-natalism" is a nazbol dogwhistle to smear queer liberation and free abortion, people like Haz have used it this way for years and it still just gets thrown around here willy nilly, it's sickening. The whole "ecofascism" thing people on here get workedup about is obviously abhorrent and eugenicist, but it is also an obscure, irrelevant position, an online oddity that has no real-world impact. Coercive pro-natalism is much more prevelant among reactionaries and is actually driving policies in imperial core and post-soviet countries. It's time we course correct on these takes.
there's a few things that get smushed together and hexbear usually isn't always interested in disentangling them
ideological anti-natalism isn't necessarily malthusian
not wanting to have kids usually isn't grandly ideological
having a "normal" amount of kids usually isn't grandly ideological (whatever normal means)
pronatalism is quiverfull shit and elon mailing his cum to people
there's no moral imperative toward a certain human population number (unless you're a voluntary extinctionist, 0, or a capitalist, infinity)
i could continue but my food is ready
When you look at AES countries, places that had the best childcare in human history, absolute job security, super low costs of living, then no, it doesn't work like that. The DDR is a perfect example. Everybody who has experienced it misses the childcare and education system of the DDR, they had a lot more women in the workforce than west Germany, raising kids was so much safer and easier and they still had lower birthrates than the west
Makes sense. I would bet the influence of religious and other societal pressures to have a kid are far more influential than economic stability. Personally I can't imagine having any kids before 30, I didn't, and it's still considered very late. How any of these 20-something parents I meet manage I'll never know.
Hexbears have to get it out of their heads that "anti-natalism" is a rightwing stance. In fact, "anti-natalism" is a nazbol dogwhistle to smear queer liberation and free abortion, people like Haz have used it this way for years and it still just gets thrown around here willy nilly, it's sickening.
I personally think the blanket ban on the topic is a relic of when it and childfree were subreddits that, in typical reddit fashion, became cesspits that used the term 'crotch-goblin' and such. I wasn't aware of the nazbol connection as I don't interact with that stuff at all but it is a troubling connection to consider.
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that rule is written because there is some depressing bozo philosophy called anti-natalism, which is not the same thing as being "against the hordes of natalists asserting you secretly want to have a baby or you'renot a real person".
Who around here has ever said that if you don't secretly want to have a baby, you are not a real person?
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this is a really weird, flattening PoV to take
i feel like i've seen enough women here lamenting their lack of uterus to say that this doesn't reflect reality at all?
I want to, but I can't, and even if I could I couldn't bear to bring someone into a world like this.
i feel like i've seen enough women here lamenting their lack of uterus to say that this doesn't reflect reality at all?
I know there's trans women who get extremely dysphoric about this, but i gotta be honest here, i'm glad i don't have a uterus. Being a mother sounds like a nightmare and it creeps me the fuck out how defensive people get about this.
i mean it's fine and good to be glad you don't have something you don't want (i'd personally rather get stabbed once a month than deal with periods) but it does appeal to other people and they're not all men looking to dip out on the parenting
kinda makes sense that people get defensive when you characterize it that way ngl
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It's hard. It's tiring. It involves a lot of self reflection and emotional regulation. Stressful as all fuck. Annoying, too.
I wouldn't say it sucks, though. I also certainly haven't offloaded my share of the burden onto my wife, either.
The feelings of love and joy I have felt because of my offspring are stronger than any I felt before.
Not for everyone, though, of course.
Facts. I have one life that has already been delayed enough by waiting to transition. Why would I willingly sacrifice more of my life now that I'm on my own?
I want to spend this post transition era of my life with the people I care about and seeing more of the world. Adding kids into that equation is of no interest to me.
IMMENSE SAME
I mean I've met some people who genuinely do seem to love parenthood. They exist. But it does suck in a lot of ways and I don't blame people for wanting to op out of it.
I think this needs some nuance. Having kids in the US especially is certainly very hard. On the whole though the positives dramatically outweigh the negatives. For me at least it is the greatest joy in life. But not without its drawbacks. My wife and I spend less time together. My health has suffered as I have less time for fitness.
Doing this without community support however is extremely difficult if not impossible. Taking care of a family consumes all your free time, and marriages suffer. No two ways about it. The relationship needs to be really strong to shoulder the burden alone.
If you have family to help that burden lightens considerably. Obviously if you are a single parent it's much harder as well. It truly does take a village and in the US we have no village.
Still I wouldn't trade being a father for anything in the world. I love my kids and raising them is my life's most noble purpose.
What the fuck are you talking about? I would kill to be a house-husband. Kids are grotesque little demons and I love them so much.
If I could unload all the burden (pregnancy) my partner and I would already have kids. I'm NEET from disabilities and would love to have a kid around to love/teach, but no uterus. My partner doesn't want the body strain which is totally fine, but it's gonna be several years before we will look adoption capable on paper. It sucks the most 'cause we're living with parents currently and that'd be ideal for baby years but life doesn't work out always.
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Compared to our parents, I think millennials had more autonomy and less social pressure (and less economic mobility) to "settle down and have kids" by a certain age. For me, my parents were part of a religion that expects marriage and children by the couple's early 20s. My partner's parents felt they were supposed to have kids by age 30, but weren't especially interested in raising them with love and care. Between health issues and employment, my parents weren't able to be as involved and provide enrichment for their kids as much as I know they wanted to.
I've got oodles of love and care to give, but this society sucks. I haven't liked it since I became aware of how it operates; I'm not gonna force some innocent unsuspecting creature to live in this world every day. Ifwhen I'm emotionally ready I'll explore human adoption, but for now, my unused parenting genes will be used on pets and plants
Millennial woman right here. Have a top 10 list for why I personally don't want kids:
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Even if I wanted kids, I wouldn't want to have them pre- successful working class revolution. A lot of people will probably die or at least be maimed, not to mention go homeless, before and during a revolution so yeah I'd rather not put an innocent little fucker through that.
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We aren't doing shit about climate disaster. I'd like there to at least be some solid plans put in place that can't be torn apart just because a chud became president again.
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I'm so fucking tired and anxious and depressed all the time. Even if my kid didn't inherit that genetically or pick some of it up by being raised by me, kids deserve better from their parents.
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My partner and I are both autistic and there's a good chance our kid would be too. Don't get too excited, I'm not saying this from a disgusting eugenics angle. I'm just saying that autism, with our current society, usually comes with extra alienation that can be really depressing and exhausting. Even if you luck out and have no learning disabilities and learn to mask really well, that too is it's own form of alienation that builds up the longer you do it as an adult. And if the kid had the kind of autism where they would be our financial dependent for the rest of their life, I don't think we could manage financially. We certainly wouldn't be able to build a nest egg for them to live off of by the time we both pass away.
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Again on us having autism. We'd lose our patience so quickly with a little kid that screams, shouts, gets sticky, pisses, shits, laughs and whines all the time. Our own kid would constantly overstimulate us and I'm afraid we'd yell at them a lot for little things and eventually burn out from parenthood.
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Personal financial responsibility was drilled into my head during most of my childhood, and while I can recognize that a lot of it was capitalist indoctrination passed down from generation to generation, I still am stuck seeing financial security in a very specific order. That order being Graduate High School > Graduate College > Start a Career > Marriage > Buy a House > Have Kids. If I were to follow those in order, then like many people I'm stuck on career. My partner has technically just started one, so let's count that and let's even assume we're really happy with each other and get married in the next year. You know where that leaves us? An awfully big step: Affording a house. And I know if we have kids before we have a house we'll probably be stuck renting for the rest of our lives. The annual expenses would simply be too high to even have an emergency savings, much less a house down payment.
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I can't afford medical costs for myself and procrastinate on health care constantly; I couldn't live with myself if I did the same thing to a kid. And if the kid doesn't come out completely healthy? I'd be setting them up for failure, maybe even a preventable death.
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Pregnancy is body horror. And I'm not even talking about the cosmetic "aww shucks I'll get stretch marks and fat and then no one will love me :(((((". I'm a fatass that already has stretch marks and my partner loves me regardless, so if anyone says that they're either incredibly young or holy shit that's a massive red flag on their partner's part. No when I say pregnancy is body horror I'm talking about teeth falling out, constantly puking, early balding, having your walk pattern permanently fucked up, pissing yourself from sneezing, hormonal hell, constant body aches, forcing an entire kid out of your womb, potentially getting surgery via C-Section, and oh yeah FUCKING DYING AFTER ALL THAT. And then I probably won't get to take more than a week off work AND EVEN THAT WILL BE UNPAID??? Fuck everything about pregnancy holy shit.
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What about adoption? I've heard mostly bad things about it even on Hexbear, so I'd rather not risk human trafficking. Even worse things about fostering. Also they do require you to make enough to support the kids soooooooooo no lol. Also I'm not paying someone else to go through pregnancy body horror on my behalf (even if I could afford it) just because "ooooooh wouldn't it be SO CUTE if our kid looked like us". Fuck that I don't care if my dependents are related to me by blood or not.
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NUMBER ONE TOP REASON POGCHAMPS:
spoiler
I just don't want a kid. I didn't want a kid when I was 5. I didn't want one when I was 10 or 15 or 20 either. I entertained the idea in my head multiple times but each time it just didn't make sense. It was never my dream. I used to chose stuffed animals over baby dolls as a kid and my mom joked about me becoming a crazy cat lady. I used to tell her that as long as I could pay the bills living by myself with cats actually sounded really nice. She'd scoff and say I'd learn eventually. Now I've got 2 little gremlin cats with no regrets, and as a bonus I even snagged an amazing partner that also only wants cats, and honestly I think my life is a lot happier for it.
Just as a counterfactual I think one has to consider that given historical marriage arrangements this feels like it'd've been the norm for most of it and that didn't stop people from recreating
Historically marriage was for working together, and kids were just a bonus. Now work is completely divorced from family, so people, who don't really have any reasons to be together tend to get eventually divorced too.
Historically marriage was for working together
Was it really, though? I favor the explanation that across societies, marriage has always served as a foundation for families. And historically, with less geographic mobility and limited contraception, affairs were harder to keep secret, also with stronger religious structures there was more pressure toward monogamy.
There are enough love poems in antiquity oriented around marriage to be a clear trend. I think people have been marrying for infatuation since prehistory, but there has been a variable aspect of workability applied to it sometimes.
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That's definitely a part of it, I'm a millenial and in my parent's circles I know of a grand total of maybe one happy boomer marriage (and it's not my parents).
Personally I just plain old don't want kids, might consider it tho if my partner wanted it (she doesn't thankfully) and there wasn't a climate catastrophe coming.
Also, I don't have strong evidence but microplastics and American food quality are lowering fertility rates. My last marrage we couldn't have kids because of health reasons that seem way more common now than they used to be.
My own parents basically let their marriage deteriorate. A lot of it was performative to begin with, just a way of checking the boxes to reify the hierarchy they were so deeply invested in.
They wouldn't listen to each other, let alone listen to their kids. No wonder things went south.
All around them were plenty of couples who stayed in love for decades. The issues seemed very fixable for a while, and the damage was self-inflicted. It ended up seeming like common sense that "you only marry someone if you affirm each other to the core and you trust them as much as yourself", and that "having kids with someone you're not sure you would marry is a recipe for strained family units".
Picking a formalized life partner and bringing new life into the world are two of the most important decisions a human can make, but there is social pressure to get marriage and kids accomplished as a momentary self-gratification. It's done for the purpose of social status, and to have somebody to own, rather than as a lifelong project. People hurry into fucking someone they like the looks of, and tying the knot. No wonder so many marriages end up failing.
Granted, if people followed the simple sensibility of distinguishing love and commitment from infatuation, and having a child out of a place of generosity, there would be a lot less children coming into the world. But with over 8 billion of us, that's not such a bad thing.
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