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If you enjoyed Breaking Bad, Better Call Saul, and/or high-concept sci-fi, just watch it. Since others have already put the Stalin line into context, I'll add another plot point that clowns hard on Carol's USian individualism:

that does sound exhausting and obnoxious but as someone who is watching it, it's only anti-communist if you go into it thinking 'communism is whenever everyone is a hivemind and has no free-will' which very well be may Vince Gilligan's take on it I guess but I think he's just doing invasion of the body snatchers 2025

It has one weird anti-communist line and even that's in a gray area because Carol is kind of a dumbass and has wrong opinions.

There's a single line from a character that is explicitly shown to not have great takes.

I like the show so far, and it doesn't seem to be anticommunist any more than most US TV.

I say this as someone who stopped watching Stranger Things many years ago because it was anticommunist slop fare.

We'll see how the first season shakes out, but I am having a lot of fun watching this show and I dont see anything that would make me write it off just yet.

To anyone reading this thread and having doubts, watch the show for yourself and be the judge. I don't think you'll have a bad time watching.

The show is a criticism of American chauvinism if anything. At least so far. The main character is a typical privileged upper class white American lib. She’s a cynic, and has all the bad American beliefs.

Like the Stalin line someone else mentioned read more like her ignorance and inability to imagine anything outside the propaganda she grew up with, than the show trying to be anti-communist.

I mean spoilers, but that Stalin line was delivered moments before we find she was responsible for like 10 million people dying… I think the show did that on purpose. Like Americans always saying everybody else is the evilest then going around committing the worst atrocities ever….

I’d say it’s a good watch, but I mean I don’t have expectation an American show is NOT gonna be lib shit. So let’s see.

I popped in the first episode just for this post-

The show seems to be an elaborate Thought Experiment in the vein of a lot of classic sci-fi: How would the average upper/middle class American react to their society transforming from an individualist one to a collectivist one overnight?

The POV character in the show isn't exactly the most flattering portrayal of the average upper-class American, I'll say that much.

Yeah, the hivemind is an old redscare sci-fi trope but I don't know, the vibes I'm getting are that ol' Vince "Breaking Bad" Gilligan isn't exactly going weigh in on the side of American exceptionalism, but I could be wrong I only watched 1 episode.

Edit: I thought about it some more- If the hivemind is actually supposed to be villainous, there's a queer reading where the hivemind could represent hetero-normative society attempting to stamp out what makes the main character (who is a lesbian) "different". But I'd need to see more of the show to see how exactly it handles queer identity beyond what was introduced in the first episode.

Double edit: Ok made it thru episode 2 and the entire scene set on Air Force One of a white person belligerently "explaining" to a room of coloured people that they have to save the world, only to engender the response of "Wait what why? The world doesn't need saving from this" is waaaaaaaaaay too on-the-nose that there really isn't any further room for discussion here.

All US media is anti-communist garbage in a way

At first I thought it was anti-communist, but then I think it's really just anti- AI with a hint of critique of "independent" living

What the hell is a Pluribus?

What does it have to do with communism? Its not a strong metaphor for a communist society as the entire social structure of the species is fundamentally altered where class distinctions are no longer relevant, instead of what one might imagine today as communist countries as those still working through the contradictions of transitioning to a socialist and then hopefully communist society.

the "what am I, Stalin?" line was crazy

I've only watched the first episode so far, if you're friends aren't interested in your analysis, I'd be interested in reading your thoughts.

86 comments, 43 upbears

oh yeah we're plurbin'

It's good you should watch it

What I'm getting from it so far is mostly "AI bad." One could argue that AI is a proxy for collectivism in the twisted mind of a liberal, but I don't know.

I feel like the show could easily veer in another direction to make a larger point. Or not.

It's perfectly watchable slop either way

i like it, there's obviously a individualist vs collectivist aspect but it doesn't harp on irl politics too much there's a single throwaway line about Stalin but there's a lot worse and more in other (subjectively)good shows, it doesn't force to viewer into thinking the hive is inherently bad(imo the hive is just a sci-fi gestalt mind not an allegory for communism like so many other hive minds in fiction, people have been commenting its like AI which Bince as said its explicitly not and it was written about a decade ago, but I see where people are getting that from), its a well made enjoyable show imo watch one ep and see what you guys think

Honestly I'm refusing to watch anything from Apple TV until its officially finished because they've cancelled so many things. I'm not getting invested into something from Vincent Fucking Gilligan for it to get ended prematurely. Had it happen too many times on streaming services. I'll never forgive Netflix for ending Santa Clarita Diet

I hated and everyone who liked it should be ashamed of themselves

The vast majority of scenes, details, plot points, "stuff" (both the stuff it points to >>>this is important<<< and the more subtle stuff) just do not strike me is fitting into the theory that this is trying to make some anticommunist point.

This is a concept show, everything must be assumed to be there for a reason. If a theory about what the message is here doesn't explain most of the scenes, it's probably wrong.

I mean, the protagonist seems pretty obviously in the wrong, she's not a good person and most all of the other non-integrated people have no problem with it. The hivemind is genuinely not dystopian, at least yet.

The Stalin line is a little anti-communist though, but just the normal amount, not a part of the core theme.