I feel like this is related to H1B visas. The Trump admin wants to ban them and one barrier I think was most of our nurses for hospice etc are immigrants (I'm filipino, this is known), so banning H1Bs would impact nursing. This may be their way of banning H1Bs while keeping the nurses around. Unsure of how nursing relates to the H1B program, I'm a software engineer my experience with it is from coworkers having the visas.
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biggest employer in many states btw, it's like they want the economy to crash
they do. they want to rule the ashes.
...Here we may reign secure, and in my choice
To reign is worth ambition though in hell:
Better to reign in hell, than serve in heaven.
Lucifer: Paradise Lost
Step one: Get into power Step two: Crash the economy Step Three: buy up every on the cheap whike destroying welfare and anything you want rid of. Step four: Monopolies for the rich, corporoticracy for everyone else.
It’s an attack on women. Nursing has historically been one of the only accepted paths for women to make a living wage. It’s an equivalent wage to the construction or police profession that is typically male dominated. I expect to see a lot of attacks on women’s ability to be self sufficient in the coming years. Subjugation and forced birth is the goal.
Sure let's cut back the amount of available nurses to an already struggling count of nurses why not. May as well just say "don't be a nurse, we don't value it." Getting the same treatment as teachers now it seems like.
Well you're welcome in Canada where you're still considered an essential service, which absolutely has "professional" all over it.
Hell, Canada NEEDS medical professionals
Yet, we elect right winger MAGA types who refuse to fund them.
I wouldn't get to excited. It also needs have a have en effective way to validate the credentials of medical professionals. The current system is extremely inefficient and leaves great professionals out.
That's fine. I'll ask my wife and her friends, a mix of NPs, PAs, and RNs, if they recognize the current administration as professional.
Answer will be no and they can kick rocks.
This is also clearly be design to cut peoples access to education as well as reduce the total number of healthcare workers. A double whammy.
My partner is a nurse here in the Northeast. Unfortunately a lot of her coworkers are Trumpies.
Most of them are practically disengaged from politics and only follow their (male) partner's political beliefs. If they're from one of the surrounding rural (white and low income) areas, the chances they're like this are higher. Not shockingly, a fair amount of their partners are cops.
It's strange and disheartening to hear about nurses she works with who flaunt that they won't get the covid vaccine, who denigrate patients with substance abuse disorder, who verbalize that they would rather not treat a trans person, and who treat black and brown folks like a different species. But it's definitely a trend in nursing culture up here.
Its especially difficult for my partner who chose this path in large part because of her acute sense of empathy. The state of healthcare is just bad here.
It's also targeting fields that are usually a majority of women on top of the access.
There are also a huge number of minorities and immigrants, especially if you're including CNAs.
Next time he has to go to a clinic for a checkup all the nurses should be out of the office
Fellas, is it good when I stop funding nursing education in the middle of a nurse shortage
They want us to die. Nothing they've demonstrated has shown anything but a deep, willful satisfaction in making American citizens suffer and a desire to kill off anyone who isn't a member of the administration.
I hope you dipshit Lemmy leftist kids are prepared to actually work to vote people out in the coming midterms and following 2028 election, and not get lost down some third-party fantasy or hold tight for "the revolution" to start.
Likely it was done due to some promise from an AI robotics firm or something.
They want to reduce the needed learning so they can pay people less to do the same job but pass it off as some streamlining process to address shortages. They're still going to charge the same for care but pay less to those who provide it.
Taking an actual problem and looking to address it from a capitalist view point so that line always goes up.
Awesome! Just as I was going to start nursing school next year. This could not be better news!! 😭
try to go abroad where nurses are still valued.
Come to Canada eh?
There is unemployment already for CDN nurses.
Don't we have a shortage...?
When the MAGA shit stains visit the ER, I hope the first nurse they see is a full blown liberal.
I think they'd relish the idea of a liberal wiping their ass.
But that's just the CNAs. Not a real nurse. Not like they'd know the difference.
Why do you want them to have qualified care?
No give them a MAGA nurse, and tell the nurse it's a liberal, and let them eat each other.
“The department determined that the following programs were professional: medicine, pharmacy, dentistry, optometry, law, veterinary medicine, osteopathic medicine, podiatry, chiropractic, theology and clinical psychology. This meant that physician assistants, nurse practitioners, physical therapists and audiologist were excluded from the list.”
Theology and clinical psychology? I didn’t even know that was a career choice, let alone one I could take out a $200,000 loan for.
Actually not sure how I feel about that. They simply classified it for the same caps on student loans as the rest of us, rather than the higher one for roles like doctors.
Both caps are bad, for all of us. Our college education rates are already far too low, and now we’re trying to make college more unaffordable?
But I guess I assumed a nurse’s education was similar to a four year degree, although I don’t know. Is it not? The nurse they quoted claimed 15 years of college: surely that can’t be normal. Isn’t that more than doctors get?
I think you've missed the point. You seem to think that the changes wouldn't affect anything. But if they wouldn't change anything, then why are they being made? So in reality, you're arguing against reality. And you're arguing against facts that people have provided you.
Nope I’m arguing that the overall change to cut financial aid is a bad one, and which category nursing falls into is a distraction
There’s a difference between an LPN, an RN, etc. Some nurses do have doctorates, which yeah, might be about the same amount of education that a doctor typically gets.
There’s a perception that nurses are “lesser” than doctors - but nursing is fundamentally a different skill set.
LVN takes about two years, RN 4, and BSN another year after RN.
Nurses are the ones delivering the majority of your care, while doctors either diagnose you or are surgeons of some sort.
To sum this up, it’s another attack on healthcare. Do you want uneducated nurses taking care of you every needs? Because nurses are all you’ve got, doctors don’t lift a fucking finger doing bedside work.
Again, y’all are are getting too hung up on the label. No one is saying they’re not critical. “Professional” in this case seems to mean “qualifies for more student loans, like Doctors”, instead of “qualifies for student loans like everyone else”. I’m not saying nurses aren’t professional, I’m saying it looks like their education costs more similar to mine than to a doctors.
AND Y’ALL ARE MISSING THE POINT. Everyone getting hung up on whether this insults the people forming the core of our healthcare system are missing the part where they’re limiting student loans for everyone
Nor should a doctor "lift a fucking finger doing bedside work." There are a lot fewer of them than nurses and they need to diagnose and manage multiple teams that are taking care of patients. No doctor has time to come and tuck you in and bring a glass of ice chips.
Most nurses also don't have the time. It's usually nursing assistants bringing you ice chips. Nurses do a lot of what many people might imagine to be a doctor's purview, or for which they might not realize the complexity and importance. E.g., it's not a doctor carefully cleaning and dressing your wounds so that you don't develop a systemic infection, nor is the doctor watching your vital signs or adjusting intravenous medication infusion rates while your organs balance on a knife's edge, nor is it a doctor who pumps you full of epinephrine to restart your heart after you've slipped off the mortal coil. Doctors diagnose and order the treatment, but nurses carry it out, and that too requires specialized knowledge and skills which necessitate intensive education. Ask any nurse, and they'll tell you that nursing school was one of the hardest experiences of their life.
But that's all kind of irrelevant to the issue, which is loan eligibility for graduate-level education for nurses. That is, for roles like nurse practitioners and nurse anesthetists, whose job functions and responsibilities significantly overlap with those of medical doctors. Much of the conversation in this thread, and the article itself, confuses that. Associate and bachelor level nursing degrees (the degrees held by most nurses, and the nurses doing the bedside care) weren't eligible for the loans this rule impacts in the first place.
There’s only a shortage of doctors because the AMA restricts the number of medical colleges so that the number of doctors is artificially kept low so that they continue to make super high wages.
Even progressive countries with excellent medical programs have a chronic shortage of doctors these days. So it's not nearly that as much as you want to think.
Learning medicine is a long and hard road and there are so many fine details you need to be perfect at. And nothing less than perfection is expected from your teachers, peers, and patients. And even yourself.
Think you're a little mixed up with your time lines :). ADN is a 2 year degree. BSN is a 4 year degree. RN is a license, no specific timeline (other than having to obtain ADN or BSN to be eligible to sit for the NCLEX).
I want to stop being surprised but I can't imagine the sheer depth of inhumanity and monstrosity of these people, and I am someone who grew up with a lifelong hatred of Nazis and their mythic-levels of cruelty.
But seriously though…. Thank god we don’t have that genocide suportin’ Kamala tho, right?
/s