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Gosh same. Me it was 2014, back when tinder still showed your mutual friends.
This vitriol around spending money on dates is so annoying. Like if it concerns you why don't you just do cheap dates like coffee or a joint by the river like a sane person?
It weeds out any people whose values don't align with yours on that front.
For me, it's not so much the idea of paying. Although most women I've dated have preferred to split the bill and I'm alright with that because it's their choice and they're choosing independence. I find that attractive.
For me, the issue is the fact that even while dismantling the idea of gender roles that previously applied to women, so many people still expect men to conform to certain gender roles, i.e. "pay for dates," "be a breadwinner/protector," "take the risks/initiative by asking the questions, making the moves, etc." (but not the wrong moves! Be confident, but not too confident!).
Of course, if a man thinks of himself as a breadwinner or a protector, people say that makes him a misogynist. But if he fails to perform those roles, then he's "not a real man" and "undatable." And people wonder why there aren't more examples of healthy masculinity? Do you understand how difficult it is to navigate all this mixed messaging?
So basically, even though I find myself attracted to independent women, if I say something to the effect of "I prefer dating women who split the bill," most people would call me cheap, or accuse me of fetishizing independent women, and either way I'd still end up being called a misogynist.
I don't date anymore, cause I got sick of all the hoops I had to jump through only to still be wrong. Sorry, but I have more self-respect than that (barely).
A lot of this stuff about men being attractive is also true of women. The attractiveness of assertiveness, initiative (and if we're being honest, having enough money to have choices on spending), are things that women look for in men, sure. But those are also things I looked for in women.
I don't want to pay for a nice dinner only to find out that the woman I took on that date only goes to nice restaurants with men trying to sleep with them, because I can't really share in that interest in the same way as I could with someone who seeks out restaurant experiences on her own. I don't want to date a woman who just sits around waiting to be asked to do things, and doesn't take initiative around how she takes control of her own social life. Those are unattractive traits in women, too.
So a big chunk of women's expectations of men they might date aren't necessarily gendered, even if they do fall within older gendered ideals: be able to pay your own bills, and maybe have some left over to do some fun stuff. Be confident and secure in your social life. Be able to stand up for yourself and those around you. Yes, that could be framed as a problematic gender expectations, but they're also kinda broad expectations of how to be attractive.
Right, and things that were originally seen as a "woman's gender role" are also gender-neutral; i.e., cooking, housekeeping, etc.
But a woman can say "I want a man who can cook!" And yet men can't say "I want a woman who can cook!"
Conversely, a woman can say "I want a man who makes six figures and pays for dates!" But if a man says "I want a woman who makes six figures and pays for dates," people call him a cuck and say he's not a real man. Women want to close the wage gap (rightfully so), but they still want a guy who earns more than them. Make it make sense.
The point is, women are allowed to expect anything they want from men. But men aren't allowed to expect anything at all from women.
It's like society took the concepts of gender roles, and tried to take the best of both worlds and give them to women, while leaving the worst of both worlds to the men. That's not exactly egalitarian.
My whole point though, is instead of being reactionary of women pressuring men to pay, the best solution is just to not attract those women in the first place by favouring cheap or free dates. Women are not all the same, a lot of women love going for a walk for a date or just getting a coffee.
I hear a lot of men - including men i know and have talked to about this in person - complaining of women expecting expensive dates, and when I've told them "just stop going on expensive dates" they respond by telling me they won't get as many dates that way and my big question to them here is "why do you want dates with the same women you were just complaining about? Is this about getting dates or about finding someone with whom you connect?"
I don't think it's reactionary. I think it comes from a common experience that single guys have. If it were easier to find a woman you connect with, who just wants to hang out and get to know you for your personality, then I suppose it would be that simple. As it stands though, women like that might exist, but they're like unicorns.
As a single guy, if you go out to third spaces (few and far between as they are, especially ones that don't center around alcohol), with the intention of finding someone to date, people will call you a creep. If you go to a hobby group to try to meet like-minded people, and you find someone you're interested in romantically, if you even so much as hint at it, people will call you a creep. If you're in public, the general consensus is "Don't bother women; they can only assume you're a predator and they'd rather be mauled by a bear than talk to you."
So meeting women in person is out of the question. But if you go to the dating apps, the vast majority of women there are either bots, or they're just advertising their instagram or their snapchat or their tiktok or their onlyfans and they don't actually check their profile for matches. And the few who actually match with you end up just wanting to sell you cryptocurrency and aren't actually interested in meeting you for a date; maybe they aren't really the person pictured in the profile.
And the relatively few real women who are actually on the apps are either filtering for height and/or income level, or fast-swiping based on looks (sucks to suck if you don't take good selfies), or if they actually read your profile then you still have to somehow manage to be unique without being cringe, seem "normal" without being cliché, show some personality without sounding self-centered, express confidence but don't be self-aggrandizing.
So that's already an impossible balance to strike on just a silly profile on a platform that's already inherently kinda cringe. So ultimately it comes down to looks, height, and income level. And even if there are women on the apps who look past that stuff, they're only really being shown the profiles of guys who pay the top-tier subscription and pay for extra boosts on top of that. And the guys who get the most likes (meaning attractive, tall, and high-earning).
And if you somehow luck out and get matched with a real woman, but you don't immediately sound enthusiastic (but not too enthusiastic, mind!), or if you some how even slightly indicate that you want to know if she's real before getting emotionally invested in the conversation, then she gets offended and calls you sexist for even implying that a scam account could be catphishing as a woman.
And if you somehow make it through all of that unscathed, and have a real conversation with a woman, even if it seems to be going well, she might ghost you at any moment without any indication as to why. It could be something you said, maybe taken a different way from how you meant it, or maybe it sounds cringe or cliché or didn't land or whatever. Or maybe you took too long to respond. Or maybe you responded too fast. Or maybe she found a "better" guy and moved on. Or maybe she went on a date with some douchebag and now she thinks all guys are like that. You'll just never know. But you have to make it through at least a week or two of navigating all of this perfectly, and then if you're lucky, you might get a first date, after which she might ghost you for any reason or no reason at all. And you probably need to go on at least four or five dates before discussing any sort of commitment or expectations after which you might finally feel somewhat secure in the budding relationship.
So dating apps are out of the question too. And other online spaces are too, for that matter, because if you bother women there then they call you a creep.
So you can't meet women in person. You can't meet women online. What's left?
But a guy can't exactly get away with saying he's searching for a diamond in the rough, because apparently that's misogynist since it implies there are women out there who don't meet his standards (such as "treat me as a person and not as a wallet." Even the implication that some women might just be looking for a free meal is seen as sexist!).
Describing the process of dating as an interview process is viewed as sexist (if you're a guy of course, because apparently that objectifies women; but if a woman describes it the same way then she's "liberated" and "empowered").
So all-in-all if a guy lucks out enough to actually land a date, and the woman suggests somewhere expensive, if he suggests somewhere cheap or free then she might ghost him and then it might be another year or two before he's offered another date. Is that really an offer he can turn down?
If you're wandering in the desert, and you're starving, and someone offers you a grilled cheese for $30, do you really have a choice to say "That's too expensive! I'll go somewhere else."? Airlines know this.
And yet society still hasn't caught up to recognize how lopsided the dating scene is. Yes, women face problems and that sucks. Most people don't deny that. But the slightest discussion of the problems men face gets viewed as an attack on womankind writ large, and immediately flamed.