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Live Updates: Prosecutors Say Trump’s Attacks Are Threat to Trial (www.nytimes.com)

submitted 6 months ago by silence7@slrpnk.net to c/politics@lemmy.world

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[-] yogi_pogi@lemmy.world 129 points 6 months ago

During jury duty, we got all sorts of shit for even whispering which court room we are going to. We were all numbers and even addressed ourselves as a number. And we were threatened repeatedly with fines and prison sentences.

This motherfucker gets to say whatever the fuck he wants and gets a bunch of verbal warnings and finger wagging.

This is why we lose trust in various govt systems

[-] dhork@lemmy.world 82 points 6 months ago

It's not just the special treatment. It's the fact that he's gonna turn around and say he's the one being treated poorly, and a good chunk of the population will agree, in spite of the plain evidence.

[-] FenrirIII@lemmy.world 24 points 6 months ago

"I'm being treated.. worse than Jesus!"

[-] abigscaryhobo@lemmy.world 10 points 6 months ago

One could only dream

[-] RamblingPanda@lemmynsfw.com 9 points 6 months ago

And the religious nuts all cheer and agree. WTF?

[-] Raiderkev@lemmy.world 14 points 6 months ago

And no judge has the balls to hold him in contempt like he's not a man facing felony charges.

[-] PhAzE@lemmy.ca 8 points 6 months ago

I think him putting in the "I'm immune to criminal charges" argument into the courts hands has actually given him temporary immunity until it's decided. It's BS

[-] ptz@dubvee.org 98 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

Maggie Haberman writes:

Todd Blanche [Trump's lawyer] says Trump is entitled to complain about “two systems of justice.” “There’s two systems of justice in this courtroom? That’s what you’re saying?” Justice Merchan says.

I mean, there are two systems of justice in this country, and he's always been part of the better one. If he wants to see what the rest of us would have to go though, by all means, let's try him under that system of justice.

[-] Neato@ttrpg.network 47 points 6 months ago

Yeah. If a non-billionaire (allegedly) tweeted out barely-veiled threats to jurors and witnesses and the judge's family that causes their friends to send death threats, you'd be in prison after you violated the gag order. Maybe not even get a gag order: just also charged with tampering.

[-] foggy@lemmy.world 22 points 6 months ago

I would literally just be held in contempt without bond if I was threatening a judge and their family.

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[-] negativenull@lemmy.world 49 points 6 months ago

So far this morning, it's all about the prosecution pushing for Contempt charges.

Justice Merchan has repeatedly pushed Todd Blanche to clarify his arguments, only to have Blanche deny that he is saying what he seems to be saying. Trump is very lucky that the jurors are not here for this. Merchan is really dressing down Blanche right now.

Blanche is Trump's lawyer (for those who didn't know)

[-] negativenull@lemmy.world 55 points 6 months ago

As Blanche insists Trump is trying to follow with the rules, Merchan interrupts him. “You’re losing all credibility with the court,” he says.

[-] kescusay@lemmy.world 35 points 6 months ago

Ouch. When a judge has to tell a defense lawyer that, things are not going well for the defense.

[-] kescusay@lemmy.world 43 points 6 months ago

Looking at the way this is going, I'm genuinely starting to wonder if Donald Trump ends up jailed for contempt sooner rather than later. It seems Merchan's patience has been exhausted.

[-] IchNichtenLichten@lemmy.world 38 points 6 months ago

"Prosecutor Christopher Conroy has just said that prosecutors are not seeking jail time for Trump’s violations of the gag order.

We are not yet seeking incarceratory penalty. Defendant seems to be angling for that … We are asking the court to impose the maximum $1,000 fine for each violation."

https://www.theguardian.com/us-news/live/2024/apr/23/trump-hush-money-trial-new-york-updates

"Defendant seems to be angling for that" ... so? Why are they taking into consideration what Trump wants? Just treat him like you would a black guy in Texas caught with a little weed.

[-] Jax@sh.itjust.works 12 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

Because if Trump can get them to act emotionally his lawyers can argue that this is a witch hunt.

They have to go through this painstaking process. If the don't they embolden his base and suddenly those definitely-not-calls-to-action are much more threatening.

[-] rebelsimile@sh.itjust.works 10 points 6 months ago

I disagree. The reason that we have gag orders is to protect the integrity of the process. The integrity of the process doesn’t have anything to do with Donald Trump, it has to do with literally everyone else. And we learned a long time ago that it’s not possible to have a fair trial when a loud defendant can manipulate the press, attack jurors and inflame the public. It’s time for him to shut up and spend some time in jail.

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[-] 0110010001100010@lemmy.world 29 points 6 months ago

Nah, he'll get another paltry $5k fine that is unlikely to ever be paid.

[-] eestileib@sh.itjust.works 21 points 6 months ago

Iirc NY law puts a $1000 cap on fines for contempt in criminal cases.

So the slap on the wrist will be even gentler than that.

If it happens at all.

[-] silence7@slrpnk.net 11 points 6 months ago

Jail and prison time are both possible though.

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[-] dhork@lemmy.world 11 points 6 months ago

The prosecution made a point of not asking for any jail time in this hearing, but rather a warning that future violations will escalate to that. I don't think the Judge really wants to jail Trump while the trial is ongoing. Trump will get a hefty fine as well as that warning. Well see how long it takes for Trump to end up in Rikers.

[-] grue@lemmy.world 15 points 6 months ago

But why, though? Trump doesn't give a fuck about fines; time spent in jail is the only thing that has any chance of getting through to him because his wealth/grift can't solve it for him.

I'm willing to bet even just sending him to the holding cells in the couthouse for a couple hours each time he makes another out-of-order outburst would shut him up real quick.

[-] dhork@lemmy.world 15 points 6 months ago

All a short term trip to jail would do is play into the Martyr complex that he and his supporters have. He would complain that he's not getting a fair trial, and low-information voters who are not paying attention will believe it.

While the judge doesn't care about Trump's political prospects, he does care that the trial is fair and that public perceptions don't make it into the jury's deliberations. But marching Trump off to a holding cell will be such an event that it would be impossible to keep it from the jury, and could give Trump a valid avenue for appeal.

However, if the judge establishes a paper trail that proves Trump was given every chance to comply, then it would make it harder for the appeal to succeed. Trump can't very well argue that the court is biased against him when they gave him extra opportunities to comply.

[-] jabeez@kbin.social 7 points 6 months ago

He would complain that he’s not getting a fair trial, and low-information voters who are not paying attention will believe it.

He has and will continue to do this, and worse, and his cult will believe all of it, and worse. We cannot make decisions, especially not exceptions to laws, based on fears of how a fascist cult of supporters will react to it. They are going to do and say stupid/crazy shit, all the time, no matter what.

[-] Daft_ish@lemmy.world 5 points 6 months ago

I don't care what it plays to. Make lady liberty stop peaking through her blindfold and treat him like the rest of us would be treated.

[-] pleasejustdie@lemmy.world 8 points 6 months ago

Because he wants to come off as a martyr to his base, and putting him in jail is exactly what he's aiming for to do that.

[-] linearchaos@lemmy.world 11 points 6 months ago

Can we try once? Just give him a night, let him know what he's up against?

[-] Shalakushka@kbin.social 5 points 6 months ago

They will make him one no matter what, deciding not to carry out justice out of fear of an angry and uninformed mob just puts decision making entirely in the hands of that mob.

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[-] cammoblammo@lemmy.world 5 points 6 months ago

The Appellate Court likes to see that judges gradually escalate through the options, not just go straight for the harshest one available. It’s likely Marchan (and the prosecution) want to make this case as appeal-proof as possible.

[-] foggy@lemmy.world 5 points 6 months ago

If he wants to complain about 2 justice systems, I think that'd qualify as "fucking around and finding out."

I can't imagine anything that would bring Americans at large greater joy.

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[-] kikutwo@lemmy.world 31 points 6 months ago

At least we know the origin of fake news, it's the orange man himself.

[-] EchoCT@lemmy.ml 12 points 6 months ago

Always was.

[-] kescusay@lemmy.world 26 points 6 months ago

Jeebus... Pecker would send Cohen articles before they were published so he could vet them. That's absolutely bananas.

[-] KidnappedByKitties@lemm.ee 8 points 6 months ago

Is it? That bit seems the least outlandish, I'd guess that happens regularly to people in power and/or with a litigious streak.

[-] bquintb@midwest.social 25 points 6 months ago

when jail?

[-] silence7@slrpnk.net 24 points 6 months ago

Two possibilities:

The judge finds him guilty of contempt and orders a short jail term as punishment. Could happen any time now that he's heard arguments, but the prosecution didn't request it, so a $1000 fine is much more likely unless he keeps on violating the gag order.
The jury convicts him, and he's then sentenced to a significant term. This won't happen until the trial is over, several weeks hence

[-] xenoclast@lemmy.world 11 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

Reality number 1: He avoids all responsibility. Avoids all punishment.

He has so far had a 100% success rate in avoiding jail time or any consequences. I hate the guy and wish that hell was real (I'll even go there too if it meant these kinds of people would) but I would never in a billion years bet against him avoiding punishment.

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[-] ForestOrca@kbin.social 24 points 6 months ago

I was curious about a specific term:

"In a pivotal stretch of testimony, David Pecker, the longtime publisher of The National Enquirer, described a 2015 meeting with Mr. Trump and his fixer at the time, Michael D. Cohen, at Mr. Trump’s midtown Manhattan headquarters.

Fixer
Noun
2. A person who uses influence or makes arrangements for another, especially by improper or unlawful means.

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[-] kescusay@lemmy.world 23 points 6 months ago

Holy shit, I wish I could be watching this live. It looks like the prosecution brought all the receipts, including ones I never even knew existed. Pecker attended Trump's candidacy announcement in 2015, invited personally by Cohen, and the prosecution have the email to prove it.

That in itself isn't illegal, of course, but it completely undercuts any future attempt by the defense to argue that Pecker and Trump weren't close.

[-] ForestOrca@kbin.social 4 points 6 months ago

"Pecker? He was just the Chai Walla. I never even knew his name." More popcorn please.

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[-] kikutwo@lemmy.world 16 points 6 months ago

But it's him so the rules don't apply.

[-] kescusay@lemmy.world 12 points 6 months ago

Seeing the latest updates, it appears David Pecker is actively throwing Trump under the bus. The increase in the level of communication between Pecker, Cohen, and Trump once Trump announced his candidacy is going to be really hard for the defense to explain away.

[-] kescusay@lemmy.world 10 points 6 months ago

Things are getting spicy again. Pecker knows Karen McDougal.

[-] FenrirIII@lemmy.world 8 points 6 months ago

Another hushed Playboy Playmate, for those who don't know.

[-] kescusay@lemmy.world 6 points 6 months ago

And now we've got a meeting in Trump Tower in August, with Hope Hicks present.

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this post was submitted on 23 Apr 2024

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