AskTransgender

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A place to ask transgender people questions and get answers about the trans experience.

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Advice for first date with a trans woman? (sopuli.xyz)

submitted 4 weeks ago by Gork@sopuli.xyz to c/asktransgender@lemmy.blahaj.zone

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Hi, I've got a date in a few days with a lovely trans woman whom I've not met before but chat online and talk with on the phone. I'd like to know if there are any faux paus in general that I should avoid.

I have reassured her that I unequivocally see her a woman, that I strongly support trans and LGBTQ rights.

For context I'm a bisexual cis man. She's pre-op but looking to get hormone replacement therapy. She doesn't seem to have dysmorphia about her nether bits, but does have dysmorphia from the negative social stigma. I didn't press too much about it as I didn't want to make her feel uncomfortable. I also shared some personal details to put her at ease about my identity so she knows I'm not just a creep.

She very much seems into me though, and is very open to talk sexually as well which I find as a good sign as it indicates very open communication.

Thanks for any advice!

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[–] hildegarde@lemmy.blahaj.zone 20 points 4 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (2 children)

I want to correct a few misconceptions to start.

HRT is the first step in transitioning medically. Gender affirming surgeries are not done until at least 1 year of HRT, but usually more. The way you said pre-op first, then pre HRT made me think you may have a common misconception about the order of events. When I came out to my supportive parents, I did have to correct and reassure them that no I hasn't already visited Dr. Dick Guillotine.

Also I rarely hear trans people say pre-op. We use the term bottom surgery. Pre implies the surgery is necessary or inevitable, which it isn't. Some trans women choose to never get bottom surgery which is fine. Others get it and that's fine too.

The medical term in the DSM is gender dysphoria. Dysphoria as in the opposite of euphoria. Dysmorphia is a very different thing, it's the mental disorder where you're obsessed over a perceived flaw in your appearance. Very different thing. Dysphoria.

Good luck on your date! Be kind, get to know her as a person. Only discuss trans things if she brings up the topic. I have never had any issues with those who are kind and supportive but uninformed on trans issues. I just get annoyed at having to give the trans 101 lecture to every person I meet.

[–] Gork@sopuli.xyz 9 points 4 weeks ago

Thanks, this is great to know! This is the sort of thing that would get me into trouble if I didn't seem to know any of the basics.

[–] dandelion@lemmy.blahaj.zone 7 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago) (1 children)

your point about pre-op is so important, since not everyone wants bottom surgery, but I am a trans woman who uses the term "pre-op" a lot, but mostly to refer to before my surgery; when talking about other trans women I might use the clunky "pre- or non-op" as a more inclusive phrase to indicate what OP originally meant by just "pre-op" (though it would only be in niche contexts, like if talking about getting through airport security or how to tuck, etc.)

On the flip side, a lot of people just assume trans women are pre- or non-op, almost to the point where it feels like "trans" just communicates "has a penis" to a lot of people, and that can be similarly frustrating for various reasons.

[–] hildegarde@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 3 weeks ago (1 children)

This is either the first time I've heard you say it, or more likely the first time I've noticed. But in my experience, the term is much more commonly used by cis people, to the point that hearing someone say, "pre-op trans woman" concerns and makes me put my guard up at minimum.

Cis people tend to have a very genital driven understanding of gender which I find concerning if not worrying. The term pre-op and the ways its often used by cis people shows that attitude clearly.

[–] dandelion@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 3 weeks ago

oh I meant more like I use the phrase a lot IRL 😅

agreed about cis people being genital focused and the term feeling different coming from them in a context like that.

tbh I think most people have a kind of implicit genital essentialist view of gender, and I'm sure that kind of view influenced my own dyphoria and discomfort with my genitals (though it's hard to tell when dysphoria is coming from social expectations or socialized ways of thinking vs something more culture-independent and presumably biological).

Regardless, my essentialist views were pretty challenged by transitioning, and I even find it difficult now to think of trans women as having "male" genitals, that's just not the reality ...

[–] heyWhatsay@slrpnk.net 15 points 4 weeks ago

Just focus on getting to know each other, besides the gender stuff

[–] anothercatgirl@lemmy.blahaj.zone 13 points 4 weeks ago

try not to bring it up in person unless she talks about it.

[–] dandelion@lemmy.blahaj.zone 6 points 3 weeks ago

I wonder what faux pas you had in mind or if there is are more specific questions you had. I'm happy to try to help answer questions you might have, but others have done a good job.

Mostly what comes to mind is the importance of good communication and not making assumptions. Trans women vary significantly in how they want to have sex or seen or treated.

I eventually came to understand trans women on estrogen have genuinely female genitals - without some effort they are not likely to function or be like male genitals. Likewise HRT does really change the biology, in ways that scientists are only now beginning to discover. Trans women on estrogen are much more "biologically female" than commonly believed. This point seems difficult for cis folks to understand, which is why I raised it.

Regarding faux pas, I don't know - it's generally as simple as recognizing and treating her as a woman. A bisexual cis man who was dating a trans girl friend of mine told me he hasn't had sex with a woman in years because he was in a poly relationship having sex with the trans woman friend of mine and with a transmasc enby (who I didn't know or meet). That was definitely a faux pas because he basically just let slip he doesn't see my friend as a woman...

In general I would say you shouldn't worry about rare mistakes if your heart is in the right place and you are sincere and making consistent effort to not mispronoun or misgender people. There is no need to be fragile or overly apologetic, trans people can be accustomed to being misgendered and mostly they want to know you saw you made a mistake and that it was a mistake, so they know it's not intentional and they are still safe.

Or at least that has been my experience.