Anarchism

First thought: Mattias Desmet's book The Psychology of Totalitarianism, may offer some insights.

... Oh, I thought I was going to have a long list of thoughts about this. But none better not already covered in that^ are yet springing to mind.

As a couple of poster here are already demonstrating, they discover that western nations have lied about communist nations, but they don't learn the more fundamental lesson that they shouldn't trust everything a nation says. So instead of adopting a nuanced view, they just counter believing everything a western nation says with rejecting everything a western nation says and instead believing everything a communist nation says.

Too often these criticism's of "tankies" involve calling questioning blatant cold war lies as tankie behavior and very often i get accused of being a tankie by both liberals and "anarchists" because i oppose the democrats its far past time to retire the word.

Im a tankie because i want there to be clean water anywhere on earth in the future. We have less than 50 years to overthrow capitalism before the earth is a depleted cinder. Marxist Lenninist revolution has worked in the past. 2 out of 3 post WW2 superpowers arose from it. Anarchist success stories include... Rojava? For a while? If you ignore all the US support and how it fell apart without that. By the time the US is weak enough that it can be destroyed without the need for regimented party and military structures it will simply be much to late.

It's also quite telling that you squishily back away from "the tiananmen square massacre" but then gesture vaguely at some other unspecified crime. Parenti called what you have an unfalsifiable orthodoxy.

I read marx/lenin, found them to be compelling.

I am very interested in the science of economic planning and ecosystem management.

Originally, I considered myself to be an anarchist, but other anarchists had a very strong tendency of supporting imperialists in their actions against non-western countries, and frankly, I'm not white enough to be tempted by the benefits I would not be gaining from installing rightist dictatorships in Venezuela or China or Cuba if the "anarcho-bidenist" types had their way.

Looking back at it I find the whole "fight" between anarchism and marxism-leninism to be very silly, but since I think that China and Hamas are actually doing useful work, this automatically makes me incompatible with many anarchists.

Actually existing socialism actually exists: imperfect, flawed, with tragic excesses and rightist deviations. But it exists.

And I'm interested in the real world, not creating an ideal world in my head that can't actually become reality.

People deify their favorite State and overlook the bad it does. All States commit atrocities so it is easier for everyone to look away rather than say "I like x about how y nation handles z" and be specific about it.

First and foremost, I think people should consume media that is not from the West. You really can't claim to be an internationalist if your media bubble (I'm including social media as well) is entirely situated within the West. To be an internationalist means recognizing that Western thought isn't the end all of human civilization. What constitutes the West is actually pretty small. It's only through imperialism that the West has a very oversized presence. But the West is only one of many viewpoints. At a bare minimum, you have to read what non-Westerners say.

But it's not just a case of picking any random non-Western country since many of their news media has been captured by the West through NGOs. Personally, I find news from Anglophone non-Western countries (India, Nigeria, and so on) to be bad overall as far as echoing what has already been said on Reuters and the BBC. The easiest way is to get out of the bubble is to pick news media from countries that are hostile to the West. That's one of the reasons why you see Russian/Chinese/Iranian/Venezuelan news media cited in ML circles. It's an easy way to pierce through the Western bubble even if you must be cognizant of the geopolitics at play. It's not the only way by any means. In many ways, social media by non-Westerners can be superior even when accounting for botting and censorship. There's a reason why the US wanted to get rid of Tiktok and I strongly suspect they will move to do the same with XHS, which actually has authentic Chinese people (of a certain demographic) on social media.

When you step outside the Western bubble, it's very obvious that the vast majority of criticism of China comes from a broader Cold War 2.0 strategy by the US to attack China. Whatever is not wholly made up is put an exorbitant emphasis on. There are numerous problems with Chinese society, of course. Many of them are actually pretty apparent if you consume Chinese social media made by Chinese people in China. However, you're not going to find this in any article by the BBC unless it's to push some ridiculous narrative about how Taiwan is going to be invaded or Tokyo is going to be nuked by China. You have to step outside the Western bubble.

When you grow up in nations that have villified communists, you default to believing all the lies and falsehoods you are told about communists.

Then one day you see people who have actually looked into those lies and found out they are made up stories by the ruling class to keep workers from overthrowing them and you think those people are "falling into the Tankie mindset," and that you are the one free from being the victim of propaganda.

It is incredibly ironic, especially when people who are "against authoritarianism" start censoring and blocking users from educating people about these topics

The destruction of american hegemony is a material necessity and their rivals thus require critical support. Call it campist if you want, i don't see western proletariat doing anything to put an end to the America's genocides and ecocides.

Personally, I kept reading and that's where it lead me. You can be part of the team too, comrade

wishing i had the mao hexbear copypasta bot right now though

Even if propaganda is involved when it comes to Tiananmen Square, it doesn't change the atrocities that were/are committed everywhere else in China.

yes it does you fucking moron, if you're being lied to about one thing, you should absolutely question whether the same sources saying shit at you are lying as well, jesus fucking christ

how do people fall into the NATO "leftist" mindset

Most people come to Marxism through being disaffected by the liberal systems we grow up in, work in, etc, and look to Marxist theory for answers. I actually came to anarchism first, found myself dissatisfied with it theoretically, then came to Marx. This leads us to organizing in real life, reading more theory, and gradually beginning to read western framing of socialist states and other designated "baddies" more critically, seeking a multi-sided and comprehensive view. There's a lot to unpack in your comment regarding preconceptions you have about China, largely being western, Red Scare style framing, but what I answered is why I'm a Marxist-Leninist and uphold socialist states as legitimate.

For a look at theory, I made an introductory Marxist-Leninist reading list you can take a peak at.

This isn't the whole story, just throwing my ¢2 in the conversation. There was a recent memorial in Canada about deaths attributed to communism. They had to remove the names off that monument as it was pretty much all fascist. So you're prettty much stating that you're pro fascist if you're against communism. And yes, it's the communists who not only defeated the German fascists, but also the Italian ones as well.