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submitted 4 days ago by Blaze@feddit.org to c/fedigrow@lemm.ee

Hello everyone,

Thinking about this as the on-boarding experience on Lemmy can be subpar, especially because new joiners have to

In order to avoid this, what would you think of having a "new joiners" instance, where

  • hexbear, lemmygrad and ml would be defederated
  • politics and news communities would be blocked at the instance level

That could help to onboard people, so that the first time they look around, they see more gardening, cute comics and casual conversation rather than another set of depressing memes.

Disclaimer: politics and societal issues are important and should be discussed extensively (they are quite popular on Lemmy, let's be honest). I'm not advocating to hide them all, just to not show them as the first content people potentially interested in Lemmy would see.

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[-] Kecessa@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 days ago

The onboarding issue isn't politics or which instances are federated, it's that federations exist for all to see when it's something that should impact the server side only and users should come to Lemmy and feel like they're joining just any other centralized website.

[-] Blaze@feddit.org 2 points 2 days ago

they’re joining just any other centralized website.

That's not the case. Users have to attach themselves to an instance or another, and the content they will be able to see will change accordingly. That's how ActivityPub works

[-] Kecessa@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 days ago

I know that's not the case, I'm saying that's much more of an issue when it comes to onboarding than anything else that was mentioned in the OP.

Instances will be what keeps Lemmy from ever becoming a true Reddit alternative.

[-] ericjmorey@discuss.online 24 points 4 days ago

Unfortunately everything is inherently political, but I can see the value of an instance that favors mainstream low controversial content.

[-] Blaze@feddit.org 7 points 4 days ago
[-] Kichae@lemmy.ca 14 points 4 days ago

Do you want to discuss the relationship between class and time-intense hobbies? Between learning/onboarding opportunites and race? The intersection of race, class, and hobbies? The ethics and economics of the sourcing of wool?

[-] spankmonkey@lemmy.world 7 points 4 days ago

Just because there are aspects that can be political doesn't mean a hobby itself is political.

I mean digging a hole can be a threat under specific circumstances but that doesn't mean that all digging of holes is inherently threatening.

[-] mortemtyrannis@lemmy.ml 4 points 4 days ago

Everything is political.

Everything.

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[-] Blaze@feddit.org 5 points 4 days ago

Reminds me when someone told me that !houseplants@mander.xyz was political due to the way plants are managed in flats.

Fine, if the "political" label isn't appropriate (which could indeed be the case), how about "stress inducing"?

[-] poVoq@slrpnk.net 6 points 4 days ago

May I interest you in some other totally non-political Trad-Wife content then? /s

[-] Blaze@feddit.org 3 points 4 days ago

Please no 😅

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[-] BradleyUffner@lemmy.world 2 points 3 days ago

Your choice of using synthetic yarn rather than the superior animal based product shows how woke you really are!

[-] ltxrtquq@lemmy.ml 2 points 2 days ago

Synthetic yarns are woke? I didn't realize supporting oil companies was woke now.

[-] Opisek@lemmy.world 2 points 2 days ago

Behold: Political debate about yarn of all things.

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[-] CidVicious@sh.itjust.works 5 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago)

I realize that a lot of people have a strong dislike of politics, but you wouldn't see so much political discussion if there wasn't an equally large number of people who engage in it. I think most people on Lemmy are probably reading the all feed rather than just local anyway, so one instance not allowing political communities wouldn't really do much. Politics aren't really limited to specific instances so defederating wouldn't really help.

Learn to use your blocklists instead. Block communities, instances, and individuals that you don't want to see. For whatever reason I find myself blocking far more individuals on Lemmy than I ever did on Reddit, perhaps because there are a higher percentage of people with extremist views on various topics here.

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[-] chloroken@lemmy.ml 5 points 3 days ago

A political-free space is an inherently political space.

[-] recreationalcatheter@lemm.ee 1 points 2 days ago

Hide the reality of this place so new users can be duped into engaging with great minds like universalmonk or yogthos?

Are you kidding me?

[-] Blaze@feddit.org 2 points 2 days ago

It's the opposite, those two would probably be banned from the instance

[-] Sunshine@lemmy.ca 1 points 2 days ago

Tankie spotted.

[-] peregrin5@lemm.ee 14 points 4 days ago

If you removed political content from Lemmy there would be nothing left. All the other communities are dead.

[-] Blaze@feddit.org 7 points 4 days ago

They are not, as mentioned in the OP: https://feddit.org/post/6554534

20 active communities which are not politics, news, memes or tech

They are indeed drown in the political content, but that's what this suggestion is trying to solve

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[-] ptz@dubvee.org 9 points 4 days ago

My instance already blocks hex, grad, and ml, so I'm halfway there lol.

The politics/news communities here, though, are present but highly curated since many of them do not meet our standards for preventing misinformation. Seriously, our rules are very strict after I first got started with Lemmy and saw what a complete shit show worldnews at .ml was.

Defederating from the big 3 "extreme" instances is one thing and very doable. The problem with running a dedicated "no news/politics" instance would be preventing users from subscribing to any. The admin would have to on top of every news community that shows up and then administratively remove/hide those. That's going to be a chore.

[-] Blaze@feddit.org 4 points 4 days ago

The admin would have to on top of every news community that shows up and then administratively remove/hide those. That’s going to be a chore.

Yes, and that brings another concept that Bluesky has and that we could use: crowdsourced blocklists. That way people can just add to the blocklist, and it gets blocked for everyone subscribing to that list.

In our case it would be done instance-level (we would need some hack so that other people can add to the communities blocklist of the instance) but the end result would be the same.

[-] Kichae@lemmy.ca 4 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

I think themed social sites are the way to go for the fediverse, almost to the point where the theme doesn't matter. Any theme. Any raison d'etre beyond "to be a general interest clone of what already exists". So yeah, I think this is a good idea.

I think the suggestion also highlights some moderation/administration features that were missing when I first tinkered with self-hosting Lemmy a year ago. Are there tools to allow users to access these types of communities while keeping them hidden from the 'All' feed? There wasn't last year. It would be ideal to designate sites and communities that are A) totally blocked/banned, B) accessible/subscribable but only via direct url search, C) searchable, but not available in All (or even local, for hidden local communities), D) accessible via All. Or even having different discovery vectors selectable via binary selection. The fine grained filtering to do such a thing would be a real boon in general, especially for sites that want to remain thematically focused, while not handcuffing users who want to be able to view stuff that's off-topic.

[-] Blaze@feddit.org 3 points 4 days ago

Are there tools to allow users to access these types of communities while keeping them hidden from the ‘All’ feed?

Not that I know of, and that's the core of the issue.

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[-] db0@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

There's no such thing as "politics-free". Everything is political. Are you going to ban also comms about veganism? climate? LGBT? even gaming is political (just look at the cringelords of gamergate).

On top of that, you don't know is the person who is interested in lemmy wants to join a "status-quo" instance like that or not. What if they were hoping to talk about some political subjects and now realize they cannot without making a new account? Bad experience.

There may be a point to be made about defaulting users to comms with less potential for flamewars, but that would require some sort of backend update.

[-] Blaze@feddit.org 4 points 4 days ago

Everything is political.

I tried to touch on that in the disclaimer at the end. I know that politics and societal issues are important and should be discussed extensively.

The issue we have now is that the All feed is overwhelmingly about serious and depressing topics. It's a hard sell to get people to join a platform that just seems as negative as Reddit, but without even the niche communities to make up for it.

you don’t know is the person who is interested in lemmy wants to join a “status-quo” instance like that or not.

Indeed, so the plan would be to have something like

  • join casualinstance.org is you want a casual experience
  • join lemmy.dbzer0.com if you want an experience with politics and news

Similar to what I already with when I suggest both discuss.online and sopuli.xyz depending on the user location: https://old.reddit.com/r/RedditAlternatives/comments/1i0652l/for_the_love_of_everything_i_just_want_to_know/m6web7p/

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[-] zante@slrpnk.net 3 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

Just join a catmeme instance and browse local, not all.

Slrpnk.net doesn’t have any politics on it. You can read about mushroom and collecting rainwater and recycling and never encounter anything polarising.

Edit :

The other thing, is that most of what passes for politics on Lemmy, is really just news and rage bait. Very few of the hundreds of submission about what Trump said or What China did, or what Pelosi think are political, they just amplify inflammatory messages

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[-] Skiluros@sh.itjust.works 3 points 4 days ago

I would argue something like starter packs would be a better fit for this particular feature.

[-] poVoq@slrpnk.net 3 points 4 days ago

Maybe a starter pack that includes a starter blocklist? 🤔

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[-] Demigodrick@lemmy.zip 3 points 4 days ago

I would counter and suggest that Lemmy implements a "default block" system that admins can set on their instance, i.e. the 3 you've mentioned, plus any others they want. When the account is created, the default blocks are applied (either instance or communities or ideally flexibility to add both).

Users can then choose to unblock these if they want to engage with that content without moving instance.

While portability is kind of a feature of the lemmyverse, your posts don't come with you so likely people wouldn't want to move off the "default" instance, which would create another problem with centralized instances.

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[-] Rob200@discuss.tchncs.de 3 points 4 days ago

I think this (lack of politics) already exists to an extent. While you can't avoid politics entirely, they'l always find a way through. Users can join a server dedicated to the topics and/or hobbies they like. Or just with a vibe that they dig. If they like anime, they can join an anime focused server. Video games? Join a gaming server.

On Lemmy I feel the server doesn't matter as much since you can just join communities after account creation and communicate with other servers anyway. Pick the communities that suit you.

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[-] Blaze@feddit.org 3 points 4 days ago
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[-] Comment105@lemm.ee 1 points 3 days ago

"default subreddits" worked well for Reddit as it was growing, I would expect it to work here as well if curated well.

Granted, it did not work out well for atheism, which was a default sub and wreaked havoc on the cultural implications of openly identifying as an atheist.

Maybe keep religion out of it this time.

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this post was submitted on 14 Jan 2025
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Fedigrow

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