this post was submitted on 06 Dec 2024
107 points (96.5% liked)

transgender

2408 readers
1 users here now

Welcome to lemmy.ml/c/transgender! This is a community for sharing transgender or gender diverse related news articles, posts, and support for the community.

Rules:

  1. Bigotry, transphobia, racism, nationalism, and chauvinism are not allowed.

  2. Selfies are not permitted for the safety of users.

  3. No surveys or studies.

  4. Debating transgender rights is not allowed. Transgender rights are human rights. Debating transgender healthcare is not allowed. Transgender healthcare is a necessity.

  5. No civility policing transgender people. Transgender people have a right to be angry about transphobia and be rude to transphobes.

  6. If you are cis, do not downvote posts. We don't like you manipulating our community.

  7. Posts about dysphoria/trauma/transphobia should be NSFW tagged for community health purposes.

  8. For both cis and trans people: Please alter your username (if possible) to include pronouns (or lack thereof, or questioning) so no one misgenders anyone. details. This rule is important for maintaining a safe place. If you can't change your ID, please let a mod know and include it in your bio.

  9. Leftist infighting is not allowed.

Please remember to report posts that break any of these rules, it makes our job easier!


If you are looking for a more secure and safe trans space, we suggest you visit https://hexbear.net/c/traaaaaaannnnnnnnnns. While we will try our best, lemmy.ml/c/transgender is far more open to the fediverse, and also to trolls. One of the site admins of lemmy.ml, nutomic, is also a transphobe, while hexbear is ran mostly by trans people and has a very active trans community.

founded 6 years ago
MODERATORS
 

The Socialists, led by Pedro Sánchez, the prime minister, included plans to limit participation in female sports to “people with a female biological sex” in a policy document decided on at the party’s congress over the weekend.

The decision to also remove Q+ from a plan to protect sexual and gender minorities from the impact of social inequality sparked fury from LGBTQ+ activists and politicians from Left-wing partners of Mr Sánchez’s minority government.

The passing of a transgender rights reform in 2023, allowing anyone to change their official sex simply by stating their wish to switch, caused a bitter rift within Spain’s ruling Left-wing forces.

Carmen Calvo, the former Socialist deputy prime minister, said at the time the reform would “destroy the powerful battery of equality legislation in our country”.

Pathetic display from so-called socialists

all 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] TGhost@lemm.ee 46 points 10 months ago

Trans rights are Humans Rights

Disgusting,

[–] chillBurner@lemmy.ml 42 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Who will betray us? Social Democrats.

[–] Luffy879@lemmy.ml 5 points 10 months ago

Wer hat uns verraten? Die sozialdemokraten. Wer war mit dabei? Die grüne Partei

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Y0xkvw-u3s

[–] lugal@lemmy.dbzer0.com 37 points 10 months ago

No one is free until everyone is free

Not really socialist of them...

[–] A_Union_of_Kobolds@lemmy.world 31 points 10 months ago

Disgusting. There is no liberation without trans liberation.

[–] CutieBootieTootie@hexbear.net 31 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Social democracy is the left wing of fascism

stalin-bummed

load more comments (2 replies)
[–] Frogmanfromlake@hexbear.net 18 points 10 months ago (2 children)

Hasn’t their socialist party been more neoliberal for a while?

[–] Gosplan14_the_Third@hexbear.net 26 points 10 months ago

It's a European socdem party, it's been liberal for a hundred years, give or take.

[–] Diva@lemmy.ml 16 points 10 months ago (1 children)

It's uncanny how you can never expect anything good to come from social democrats.

[–] Feline@hexbear.net 5 points 10 months ago (1 children)

It's surprising because last year, they actually did pass a good law: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ley_Trans

[–] remolatxa@info.prou.be 2 points 10 months ago

They actually cut it down quite a bit from what it was a grassroots law with support of politicians. And it was possible amidst the inner confusion of PSOE itself, with its transphobe "feminism" wings taking positions inside the party. There was a gap of possibility between the two discourses:

transphobe discourse representation


"we are trans-friendly as long as it's a secondary issue and you don't threaten the binary status quo" and this "trans women with penis are trying to erase us women and must not enter women toiltets"

[–] CoolerOpposide@hexbear.net 16 points 10 months ago

Lesser of two evils moment

[–] HiddenLayer555@lemmy.ml 11 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Social Democracy != Socialist in the same way National Socialist != Socialist

Social democrats are 100% capitalists, they share almost no common values with socialism. As others have mentioned in this thread, social democrats are concerned with how the capitalist machinery and the dictatorship of the bourgeoisie can be maintained.

This article repeatedly calling them socialists is nothing short of journalistic malpractice. They're smearing the wrong ideology which was their intent.

[–] kernelle@lemmy.world 7 points 10 months ago (8 children)

Ignorant passerby here, and genuinely want to change my mind, but how exactly is it fair for a trans person to compete against a biologically female person?

If we go back to the original reason for this sexist devide, it stems from a fundamental biological difference between two genders. How we identify ourselves has little impact on these biological differences no?

Furthermore I was listening to a podcast recently and they were talking about how the greatest female tennisplayer to have ever lived is would be ranked 2 or 3 thousand in a unisex world ranking. Seeing a worldrecord being set by someone working within the confines of the female body is impressive, seeing that same record broken by someone without the same constraints just devalues the other persons achievement.

[–] finderscult@lemmy.ml 19 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

So a few things;

A) on the professional level sports ain't about fair. It's about who has the biggest natural advantage and enough money and time to develop the skills to make use of that advantage. Take the Olympic swimmer Michael Phelps who has genetic mutations, plural, that mean we're likely to never see anyone ever break his records.

Now that's just the professional level, and a less than professional level sports are about fun, not fairness; and in a team game it's about teaching social skills over fun.

B) post bottom-surgery on hrt trans people, either main direction, have no biological advantages. In mixed leagues there are trans women that are far below cis women, and there are trans men far below cis men. This scare mongering that trans women specifically would have this massive advantage simply isn't represented in the real world where trans people have competed with cis people directly.

C) You want the secret to athleticism? It's not sex, it's t level. Testosterone is literally the magic key for sports. Trans women that no longer produce as large amounts of t (see. Above) consistently under perform cis women with high natural t levels. To preempt this as well, bone density isn't fixed. The Joe Rogan scare mongering on women's boxing is that trans women supposedly have higher bone density than cis women. This can be true, sometimes, but most often it's not. Estrogen attacks bone density, and does so ridiculously quickly when you have elevated levels from any source. It takes just 3 years on average for your bone density to drastically change when your hormones balance changes.

D) this type of discrimination leads to false accusations, harassment and death threats more than preserves any integrity in sports. The Olympic boxer Imane khelif is a cis woman. XX. This trans hysteria has tainted her win, because she doesn't look woman enough, whatever that means. Many cis women that don't fit the local stereotype of "woman" are harassed because of people freaking themselves out about the trans Boogeyman. This type of harm outweighs any and all harm to sports, period.

[–] princessnorah@lemmy.blahaj.zone 6 points 10 months ago

B) post bottom-surgery on hrt trans people, either main direction, have no biological advantages.

I've never before heard of this need for bottom surgery to even out any biological advantages. Can you explain more, or provide a link to some more info?

[–] Catoblepas@lemmy.blahaj.zone 17 points 10 months ago

Equating transgender women with cisgender men is biologically inaccurate.

The tests assessed body composition, lung function, cardiopulmonary exercise testing, strength and lower body power.

Among the results was a determination that the trans women athletes had decreased lung function compared to the cis women athletes.

In addition, the bone density of the trans women athletes was found to be equivalent to that of the cis women. Bone density is linked to muscle strength.

The researchers say their findings “reveal notable disparities in fat mass, fat-free mass, laboratory sports performance measures and hand-grip strength measures between cisgender male and transgender female athletes.

“These differences underscore the inadequacy of using cisgender male athletes as proxies for transgender women athletes.”

[–] TropicalDingdong@lemmy.world 13 points 10 months ago (2 children)

The broader issue is discrimination, and if one class of people should be allowed to be singled out and discriminated against.

[–] LaLuzDelSol@lemmy.world 6 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Isn't that the whole point of women's sports though? To exclude a class of people (men) so that others (women) have a chance to compete on their own?

[–] kernelle@lemmy.world 0 points 10 months ago

For sure, I am very aware of the overlying issue here. And let it be known that I have always been supportive of the movement.

[–] emergencyfood@sh.itjust.works 6 points 10 months ago

Two points:

  1. Top-level sports isn't fair. Most famous athletes are outliers in terms of height, weight, muscle mass, etc. Some, like Phelps, have genetic or developmental differences that give them a pretty significant advantage.

  2. I must admit that the legal definition of 'transwoman' varies from country to country. In India, where I live, a person can legally change their gender without any medical intervention, and such people might have a physical advantage over cis-women. But in the vast majority of countries, they have to take hormones and / or do surgical procedures that reshape their body to be more 'feminine'. Once they do that, they have no significant advantage over cis-women.

[–] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 6 points 10 months ago

Social Democrats and highly reactionary tendencies, who ever could have guessed? Objectively the moderate wing of fascism. Who knew that adopting leftist aesthetics to maintain Imperialism and Capitalism via concessions is a tendency of transphobes?