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He got me to read the Manifesto and would have hours' long debates with our social-democratic roommate and now this. It's really shaking me up a bit.

He is on the whole defeatist 'nothing will fundamentally shake the imperial machine so might as well pick the wardog with better domestic policies' tip. I want to get through to him but I am getting stuck.

For example:

i also refuse to not vote my conscience but i figured this time its not like doing this abstract process to pick if id prefer -100 points vs -200 points is gonna matter that much if i genuinely believe itll even be slightly better under kamala i might as well

kitty-birthday-sad

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[-] REgon@hexbear.net 17 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago)

i also refuse to not vote my conscience but i figured this time its not like doing this abstract process to pick if id prefer -100 points vs -200 points is gonna matter that much if i genuinely believe itll even be slightly better under kamala i might as well

Not calling your buddy Ben Shapiro, but that's a Shapiro-esque sentence. Throw out as much shit as you can is as short a time as possible so that any response would basically have to be novel length.

  • He says he will not vote for his conscience, yet he votes for someone he clearly views as bad.
  • He says the process is not abstract, then makes abstractions.
  • He says he believes things will be slightly better under Kamala (not incorrect, it's his belief. It is the belief that is wrong here. Things will not be better under Kamala)
    a. going into the third point requires a lot of work, and I can imagine you've already talked a lot about that particular topic, so that's also just shitty of him to disregard whatever you've said like that.
  • Unrelated to the sentence, but if he is defeatist then he should view Trump as the better of the two candidates, considering the fact that he is currently experiencing the system under Kamala-lite (if he believes what she says, she is basically campaigning on being a more right-wing Joe Biden)

I personally would focus on how voting for better domestic policies will do nothing but make things worse. The extermination machine will not stop in Gaza, it will come home. There will be no better domestic policies. I would focus on the massive resistance towards all the things the dems are doing, that Trump couldn't do because he was either incompetent or because the general populace exerted enough pressure to stop it.
Trump pardoned a sheriff and even that was a massive scandal (as it should be, but let's not pretend people would have given a shit under Biden.)

edit: on the bright side you get to give your friend the experience every leftist dreams of: Living in a world were they are considered reactionairy

[-] miz@hexbear.net 21 points 3 days ago

I hope I am shot in the head immediately if I ever debase myself like this. your friend is dead inside already

[-] MF_COOM@hexbear.net 17 points 3 days ago

Radicalize them

[-] Mokey2@hexbear.net 8 points 3 days ago

Voting doesnt matter, you can vote if itll save your friendship but its not going to do anything else and they should know that

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[-] electric_nan@lemmy.ml 13 points 3 days ago

It really doesn't matter who he votes or doesn't vote for. Everybody is anxious for reasons good and bad. Just let him do what he wants. He'll probably feel dumb about it later. I won't vote for her, and I'll tell people why, but I don't tell them not to either.

[-] ChaosMaterialist@hexbear.net 14 points 3 days ago

He is on the whole defeatist 'nothing will fundamentally shake the imperial machine so might as well pick the wardog with better domestic policies' tip.

I'd throw that right back as the reason you aren't voting lmao!

Why get worked up if nothing is fundamentally going to change?Because, sniff, they ideologically do act as though things can change zizek-ok

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[-] Moonworm@hexbear.net 12 points 3 days ago

What are you trying to accomplish?

[-] bubbalu@hexbear.net 16 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago)

I just want him back j.j I am trying to counter-program him I guess. He already voted so it's a moot point.

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this post was submitted on 29 Oct 2024
126 points (95.0% liked)

chapotraphouse

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