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Oh my, what's that thing? I tried nostr earlier this year after reading about their tech side and finding it interesting, but then I met their human side and... it was shocking (I lack words to properly explain the feeling). Most posts were, in order of amount of occurrence: cryptocurrency praising like it's 2015, bashing on leftism, some weird humor I didn't understand (maybe it was better not to understand), anti-government stuff, racist memes and a (maybe lost) user that posted some beautiful photos they took as amaetur photography practice. I literally stopped scrolling and uninstalled it when I saw a post claiming that pasteurizing milk is a genocide and an act from the government against us (the other users were even endorsing it!)
Definitely a good technology overrun with cultists. Better content curation tools & more users will fix it
Heads up, I sometimes post screenshots of replies like this as examples of how nostr looks to outsiders, because those cultists act confused about why no one joins
Did you say screenshot? I better fix the typing errors and dress my finest clothes!
It's a shame that Nostr's brand is tainted by its community in a lot of people's eyes, there's a lot to like about it as a protocol and as a free software project that is independent from that stuff.
Tbh I think of Lemmy in the same terms. Like, people contemplating coming here from e.g. Reddit could block all the anti-Western propaganda (e.g. calling for actual murder against us), and find some pools of content that are halfway worthwhile... but like, why would they bother? For the ideological purity of not contributing to enshittification? Anyone who thinks that way is already here though.
Whether facing "leftist" tankies on Lemmy or "conservative" right-wingers on Nostr, mainstream non-technical normie users are going to just nope right out of either.
If you avoid one or two instances you rarely encounter tankies on Lemmy. You'll still encounter leftists, but that's a good thing.
Almost no instances defederate from Lemmy.ml. And I had accounts on multiple instances that federated with both lemmygrad.ml and Hexbear.net. None of that was explained anywhere, we early adopters just had to figure it out.
And who tells new people to avoid Lemmy.ml in the first place? That join Lemmy website that "randomly" picks an instance for you has even selected it for me, as well as hexbear.net.
Face it: we are a Nazi bar. Yes it's possible to walk through the crowd of Nazis at the front door to our corner of the room where it's cool, but I understand if my Jewish friends will refuse to accept my invitations, seeing who they will encounter on the way over.
I get your point about he company we keep, but tankies are typically authoritarian communists, not Nazis, and antisemitism isn't usually a part of their outlook. You'll find far more fascists on other social media platforms.
Sorry for being confusing, but you are correct, tankies are not literal Nazis - I was referring to the Paradox of Tolerance whereby, as some may consider paradoxically, when we attempt to tolerate everyone then in reality we will become less free than if we would exclude those who would act to take freedom away from others (this logical principle is often called by the "Nazi bar" effect, where you yourself may not be an actual "Nazi", or in our case a tankie, and yet by virtue of association we are seen as such by Redditors who might otherwise flock here and contribute much more content than we currently have here).
Edit: here is an interesting comparison to ponder about. In this post (trigger warning: on Reddit) https://www.reddit.com/r/RedditAlternatives/comments/1putgx5/lemmy_release_v01915_and_testing_for_10/ from yesterday, it mentions a Lemmy updated version, and do you see where the linked URL leads? Directly to lemmy.ml. Contributions to advance the Lemmy source code are also subverted into use to administer the Lemmy.ml instance, the only way to avoid that happening being to donate specifically to Nutomic directly. Lemmy code == Lemmy.ml, by the very devs of the platform. In contrast, here is another post https://www.reddit.com/r/RedditAlternatives/comments/1pu7vkf/piefed_14_is_released_emote_reactions_ai_content/ from the day before that, and its primary link is to codeberg for the actual software, and only secondarily are links provided for more info on PieFed.social. It is possible to have a federated threaded-based conversational platform that is not primarily run and at least somewhat controlled by tankies. And yet even PieFed.social does not defederate from Lemmy.ml.
so just nazi-lite, just without most of the racism and bigotry. from what ive seen alot of them posting on here, comment the same way conservatives do, same shtick
I think you hit the nail on the head. I run my own piefeed instance and I have lemmy.ml and hexbear a long with a few others blocked on it. But I had to KNOW about those before hand. It's not like Reddit where you pretty much have to go looking for that content if you want to see it and/or block it.
I'm by no means a fan of moderation but I think we need to at least have some kind of rating system when selecting an instance or something and not have it be purely based on user count. Have it similar to how we already have it with users where you can see without clicking on anything if a user has a bad reputation. just add that to instances.
There is such a thing for Lemmy, and Lemmy.ml has a "good reputation" listed on it.
See it here: https://gui.fediseer.com/instances/detail/lemmy.ml, noting the 15 "endorsements" (think upvotes) and only 2 "censures" (think downvotes), with another 2 "hesitations". Fwiw, PieFed.social has 6 endorsements (all by Lemmy instances iirc) and 0 censures and 0 hesitations. lemmy.dbzer0.com has 49 endorsements, 136 censures, and 2 more hesitations.
So people definitely put censures and hesitations for some instances... just not lemmy.ml. Possibly the system admins are too afraid of being known by the very developers of the code that they are running on their machines to call it out? (I don't have to remind you of all people that system admins in most countries cannot be anonymous - unlike the rest of us, most people in that situation have to register with their country to be responsible for the content shown, e.g. CSAM). Mainly around lemmy.ml there is simply... silence, by the vast majority of the Threadiverse.
Which matches every other policy surrounding Lemmy.ml around the Threadiverse: chiefly silence (at the "official" levels, e.g. sidebar text on an instance or in official documentation), leaving new people to have to constantly keep discovering what is going on regarding it, mainly on their own.
I thought ‘what's wrong with db0 that it received so many censures’, turns out it received 0 censures, it gave 136 censures to other instances
Then are censures received what "hesitations" means, or does that site just make no sense whatsoever to not have access to censures received on the page where it would make the most sense?
I can't make sense of what you asked, but in case of db0, they just received 0 censures, those are shown for all of the instances, if they are given or received
Fair, I'm not sure what the solution would be though, even if you explicitly want to optimize for getting as many people as possible using decentralized social media regardless of their politics or cultural preference, some kind of niche culture is going to form.
If you want an abortion, but your neighbor is willing to fully, literally, and actually kill you for attempting to get one, then how do you get along? Indeed...
The above example is auth-right, while tankies are auth-left. The common denominator is the auth part. You either give in and do whatever the other side wants, or... you do not do that.
Platforming the auth-left seems similar to trying to get people to join Reddit. Either way you are helping someone else feed forward their agenda, which will ultimately arrive at a bad ending.
I do note that PieFed is building an entirely new future, neither platforming tankies nor seeking profits to the exclusion of all else. I am putting my hopes into it.
Honestly normies shouldn't even be on the internet
What's stoping you from creating leftist hotspots in Nostr ?
The fundamental architectural decisions are stupid in precisely the way all libertarian projects are and make healthy behavior maladaptive for potentially toxic agents that might otherwise remain relatively innocous.
Thus it would be like trying to build a home at the bottom of the ocean or some other extreme hostile environment, the question becomes why?
Oh potentially toxic ? Who decides what's toxic ?
Human moderators empowered with collective power given to them by a community..
Well well well.... there you have it. So those humans cannot create a space for you ?
Well well well.... there you have it. So those humans cannot create a space for you ?
You think those are gonna convince anyone?
They can either be convinced or embarrass themselves ignoring evidence. Either way, proving a statement is ridiculous is proving it's ridiculous
How is ignoring evidence embarrassing? To you perhaps, to me certainly. But why would it embarrass them?
A better word is it completely crushes their souls and makes their final moments unimaginably miserable, but that's heavier to type out so just "embarrassment" for shorthand works
You're convinced being right has any fucking value.
And I'm right about that too...
Not in discourse, politics, or persuasion. If anything it's a liability.
Not sure what you mean
Nobody cares about the truth, and by virtue of being true, something is harder to weave into narratives anyone gives a single fuck about.
Or, sometimes people care about things being true-studies have shown that citing sources can entrench opposition, and in fact does so much more often than it convinces anyone.
So?
So it's just for your own edification. Which isn't nothing, but socially? Truth is at best useless. Especially now.
Now is a brief moment
21st century isn't for everyone.
At this part it sounded like you started conflating "now" with "the next 75 years" and trying to downplay the impact my work should have on that timescale
Sounds like you're just a dishonest person attached to a society that props up such people, and being dishonest about that too instead of thinking straightforwardly about it
Upvoted your comment anyway on the basis of pretending you understood the meaning of your words, in which case your point was the so-called "21st" century isn't for my enemies, even though in reality you probably used the same sequence of words to imply the opposite - that you're persisting under the delusion humanity will magically handle the consequences of another 75 years of denialism before anything changes to benefit people like me
I was quoting a book.
That's why I hesitated for 3 days on my reply, I sensed I was giving a dumb reply but gave into my impulse in the end
It's fine. Nobody reads books. I'm just a total loser. The book in question takes place at the end of the 21st century, and the flashbacks to earth are bleak as fuck. Basically nobody's relevant unless they're extremely posthuman in some way or other, with all associated costs. The people who couldn't stay employed in the few jobs that still matter mostly retreat to a solipsistic version of 'the matrix' while their bodies atrophy away to nothing, in part because reality's so fucking terrible.
We don't have the vivid full sensory computer simulation, or the post-scarcity-but-still-a-nightmare shit hole, but we got all the solipsism.
What book is it?
I think 'blindsight' but might be the sequel.
Thank you 🤙
Now may last longer than you wish
Yup, it's beautiful. You know you can block, though, and filter content to only those you follow?
IMHO it would work better like a web of trust, than having to either whitelist or play whack-a-mole. I'd rather just join an instance that doesn't allow racism.