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[-] Ryumast3r@lemmy.world 44 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)
[-] willy_wallace@lemm.ee 27 points 1 year ago

I mean, most Christians would say yes because that's the entire premise of the crucifixion.

[-] Thoven 15 points 1 year ago

This interpretation leaves out the most important part of the crucifixion story: Jesus willingly took on the world's sins out of love. So whether or not most Christians would say yes depends on if the one person being tortured has a choice in the matter, which is unspecified in the question.

[-] Terevos@lemm.ee 5 points 1 year ago

I came to say the same thing. This is exactly what Christianity believes.

But of course, it was Jesus who gave himself willingly.

If he was forced to do that, it would've been reprehensible because he was the only truly innocent person who ever lived.

[-] Griseowulfin@sh.itjust.works 24 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Ones_Who_Walk_Away_from_Omelas

Basically the plot of this story. It poses the issue of how much we value society over the individual, and if that is good or not. Would you want to live in a world that depended on the the torture of a single person. You then could extrapolate that out to societies in the real world, US and chattel slavery. the west and the use of sweat shop labor for cheap products, the Emirates and their use of migrants as indentured servants. Even tipped wages for servers in the USA, the gig economy, and things like medical residencies could be considered a minor version of Omelas. As humans, we often tolerate the abuse or exploitation of others for our own benefit, or even just out of ignorance and inaction.

[-] AsimovsRobot@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago

A great story that illustrates this question really well. It is by Ursula K. Le Guin, written in 1973, if anyone is wondering.

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[-] sin_free_for_00_days@sopuli.xyz 3 points 1 year ago

It is a quick read. One of a handful of stories that I have gone back to over the decades.

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[-] OptimusPhillip@lemmy.world 18 points 1 year ago

If that one innocent person agrees to it, I say yes. Otherwise, no.

[-] intensely_human@lemm.ee 3 points 1 year ago

If nobody volunteers, we all go down.

[-] intensely_human@lemm.ee 13 points 1 year ago

No it’s not morally preferable. Fuck that world that requires human sacrifice.

[-] SeahorseTreble@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Just out of interest, what if we make it a (not-human) animal instead of a human? Or, what if we make it trillions of animals every year. What about a world that doesn't require it but still includes mass amounts of animal sacrifice unnecessarily? That's the world we're in right now 😂

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[-] potterpockets@sh.itjust.works 13 points 1 year ago

Do you mean ultimate badass Talenel’Elin , Herald of War?

[-] Hyggyldy@lemmy.world 8 points 1 year ago

He. Did. Not. Break.

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[-] jet@hackertalks.com 11 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

I'll take a different approach here. Evolution does not care about your feelings.

If a species is unwilling to self-sacrifice for the greater good, and it comes up against an event that cannot be solved with selfishness, it goes extinct. Like in this scenario.

But evolution is a motherfucker, and evolution does not care about your feelings, the only thing that matters to evolution is reproductive success. So some people are going to be altruistic because that's better for the species because it makes it more survivable.

I'm not saying it's right, I'm not saying it's wrong, but the species that's going to survive is the one that's willing to self sacrifice for the greater good of the species. To increase reproductive success. And that's what's going to be left in the universe. Because evolution does not care. You either get with the program or you get out of the gene pool no other option

[-] gapbetweenus@feddit.de 8 points 1 year ago

Evolution is not a good base for morals. We tried it out - was really bad.

[-] GiuseppeAndTheYeti@midwest.social 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Now hold on. How can we be certain? Maybe holocaust 2: electric boogaloo will be better

[-] gapbetweenus@feddit.de 5 points 1 year ago

I'm in Germany, so not sure if allowed to answer.

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[-] lath@lemmy.world 9 points 1 year ago

An inherently flawed world maintaining its function through cannibalism will inevitably devour itself into nonexistence. Why prolong its suffering?

[-] afraid_of_zombies@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago

Has that happened? No really I am asking for evidence. We have had forms of slavery since our species began. It wasn't like one time we had a slave 20,000 years ago. The world still basically works with humans using humans. We don't have to like it, we should fight it, but the idea that you are stating that if we are bad once we lose everything doesn't match with the facts that we have.

I am typing this while wearing clothing made by children on a phone made by slaves in China.

[-] DeanFogg@lemm.ee 7 points 1 year ago

Is that person Rupert Murdoch? Then yes

Haha, innocent. He doesn't really fit the description.

[-] DeanFogg@lemm.ee 2 points 1 year ago
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[-] DoomBot5@lemmy.world 2 points 1 year ago

Can we torture 10 deserving people instead of 1 innocent?

I'd just walk away from Omelas.

[-] AsimovsRobot@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago

A great story that illustrates this question really well. It is by Ursula K. Le Guin, written in 1973, if anyone is wondering.

[-] monobot@lemmy.ml 6 points 1 year ago

I think it has happened numerous times already under the same pretense.

I am not sure if we are saved or not.

[-] kent_eh@lemmy.ca 4 points 1 year ago

Are you trying to make an arguement for Christianity?

[-] Shardikprime@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago

Unfair to ask the question in the incomplete form.. The tortured person is you. Now answer

[-] octoperson@sh.itjust.works 4 points 1 year ago

Nope. That's a world that's not worth saving.

[-] quicksand@lemmy.world 8 points 1 year ago

Is it really though? Injustices happen all the time here. I want to agree with you but I'm struggling to come up with good justifications for it. Can you explain your thinking a little bit?

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[-] gapbetweenus@feddit.de 3 points 1 year ago

I would not do it, if somebody else does it - so be it.

[-] karmiclychee@sh.itjust.works 3 points 1 year ago

"healthy unemployment rate"

[-] OsrsNeedsF2P@lemmy.ml 3 points 1 year ago

Come torture me

[-] treadful@lemmy.zip 2 points 1 year ago

Random people we've never heard of get tortured every day for less. What's one more? Jack Bauer will do whatever he needs to do so everyone else can live and the world doesn't end.

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this post was submitted on 08 Aug 2023
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