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static stretching is for cool down & recovery, with the goal of increasing mobility when you're already warm and loosened up.
dynamic warmups, especially in your specific problem areas (knees/shoulders), will help prevent pain and injuries.
source: 20 years of lifting and rugby with enough injuries for a minor in PT. I've learned my lesson(s).
absolutely this!
I also think static stretching has its place in injury prevention for day-to-day sprains and injuries. Longer, more pliable muscles = not tearing your hamstring if you accidentally fall into a split. They can be great teaching tools too, and can incorporate some core training.
But otherwise foam rolling, banded distractions, dynamic warmups get the job done just fine. Even just starting right into a warmup set if the motion feels good already.
At that point then stretching is a different form of working out or exercise. Which makes a certain kind of sense.
love a good foam roll sesh. it's usually the first part of my warmup. I know the science is out on it's actual benefits, but nothing helps with soreness and getting the body going like working out all the kinks on a roller.
sameeeee! It's a form of self-massage, and massage is well understood more generally. it won't make muscles longer but it'll help a lot with adhesions, tender points and postural tension.
recently I've been getting some great results out of using a harder plastic massage ball for some areas, seems to get deep into my psoas, quads and calves especially. also love using a racked barbell to mobilize triceps, rotator cuff, and hamstrings! it hurts so good!
I still keep an old lacrosse ball in the gym bag for that exact reason
This! I'm disabled, so when I started powerlifting, I took extra care to ensure I was doing things safely. Although it can be hard to parse the research, everything that I read supported what you describe (and the strategy seemed to work well for me, given that I didn't end up crippling myself further)
love to hear it. muscles are definitely akin to springs - stretching them out before a lift or sports can limit your ability to perform. powerlifting and mobility are incredible tools for longevity and it sounds like you found the right combo.
There is more to stretching though, it provides a different type of strength, not quite evident unless you do deep stretch, holding a position for an hour.
fair enough. I meant more so in the context of pre/post workout, but I agree. mobility work is the same as weight training in that more consistent you are, the better you get at it. the seasons I would do hot yoga on off days made me stronger and more stable in everything else, especially lower body power.
I also still sit in a deep squat a few times a day, to make sure I'm a comrade found. if you've got an electric toothbrush with a 2 minute timer, holding that deep squat for the full time period is an excellent way to get a little mobility work and it calms my ADHD need to multitask.
That hot yoga is just too hot, in the'90s would Be nice, 105, one degree under brain damage level Is too hot for me.
you're not wrong. a lot of the places I've been to have different temp classes - when I first started I'd do the 105° classes but there have been plenty of times I needed to step out and take a break to cool off.
last place I used to go to had 95° classes that were more fitness/strength focused, and that was definitely my sweet spot. plus, nothing prepares you for running in the heat like holding a plank in a hot room.
Every physical therapist I've been to has said that stretching cold muscles is actually more likely to injure you than doing some light cardio to warm up before stretching.
Many sports coaches have said to me that stretching cold muscles worsens your performance and that you should stretch AFTER the exercise to aid recovery
Dynamic stretching before exercise and static after (plus before bed).
As an athletic trainer, I describe it like so:
Think of your muscles as a rubber band. If its cold, then its more at risk of snapping under load. To warm it up, you stretch it gently repeatedly. (Dynamic stretches) You don't stretch it to its max and hold it there. (Static stretching) You're just exhausting the elasticity. Saving static stretches for after activity keeps the rubber band from bunching up and sticking together as it cools down again.
An injured muscle could be described as being "colder" or like rubber bands stick together sometimes. And the best way to fix them is to work them back to normal in a controlled manor.
exactly, stretching is to prepare muscles that you are going to be stretching abnormally during whatever exercise you are doing
if you look at rugby players these days they sit on a exercise bike to keep the muscles warmed up. gymnasts will be doing very different warm up
I don't know if stretching reduces injury, but I know if I don't take a few minutes to work my fingers, wrists, and forearms before hammering at the anvil, I end up with a ton of mis-strikes and cramps until I'm fully warmed up. Precision suffers when I don't stretch.
I have always considered stretching more of a form of mental preparation than a form of physical preparation anyways.
It is both. Stretching is a kind process that prepares both your mind and your body for the work is coming ahead. It is absolutely necessary to get your body to produce the maximum output. It's like having a small cup of tea before you force your heart rate to 190 (short of a heart attack,) Someone else mentioned , you have to warm up, then stretch. Then workout, then stretch as a cooldowm to achieve fficiency.
Ehhhh, I read a bit of the article. My takeaway is that (1) static stretching, (2) as part of a warmup, (3) for sports that don't require a ton of range of motion may not be super helpful.
Quoting the paper, "Injury prevention and other effects of stretching remain poorly investigated"
Yeah lol if i dont stretch before climbing im literally gonna be injured 5 minutes later.
Still weird to me that we don't have evidence in the other direction! It's been 20 years
“Injury prevention and other effects of stretching remain poorly investigated”
if the above really does appear in the article, this whole post should be removed imo.
We have 5 review studies. The material to review is mid, but all find essentially no benefit from stretching.
I hedge in the title, because I'd love someone to pull up with a controlled modern trial. Alas, no such luck.
Probably, possibly, plausibly, etc all make me believe stretching DOES reduce injury.
Note these methods are enough to support/detect effects of other safety practices.
Science isn't certain. We make mistakes. The rule 'doubt all who hedge' is how we get the republican party.
not how science works
Unfortunately this kind of science really sucks because there are just so many variables to account for, and it's impossible to do a blind study.
This is a topic where there's basically guaranteed to be conflicting results in different trials.
For sure. That's kind of my point. Scientists being careful with their language and not making strong claims doesn't indicate that they are wrong.
What about being flexible, does being more flexible prevent injury?
Being more flexible helps to a point, depending on the activity. Being too flexible is a thing, if your body doesn't have the strength to handle the new range of motion. Strength is VERY important to control what your body is doing. Being able to move a bunch of places without control is bad. Conversely, having the strength to move a body part without the flexibility to move it can also be bad.
As with nearly everything in life, balance is key.
Yeah, it's all about various systems being balanced. Some people who have muscle pain try to ease it through stretching that muscle, but that can actually make things worse if the underlying problem is that the muscles that act in opposition to the painful muscle are too weak.
It depends. Like, we should really use common sense here.
If a lack of flexibility results in compensatory movement patterns, or results in force being directed to a small, fragile joint, then yes, a lack of flexibility can result in injury.
On the other hand, if you are very flexible, but do not have strength in your full range of motion, you can also end up putting large amounts if stress on joints in ways they were not meant to handle.
The contortionist and the powerlifter are both very capable athletes in their own rights. But they should be wary of toying with the other's sport.
New fetish unlocked.
Not necessarily. You can be flexible and still have tight muscles before working out or because of a previous day's workout. Your tightness point might be more than a less flexible person is capable of, but it's still a tight muscle.
For me, I have flexible glutes relative to my hamstrings (not hypermobility), and I pull my glutes on a regular basis.
im incredibly inflexible for splits and such with the legs but have always been able to folkd up my knees and have my butt on the floor (ok not as much at this age). I can grab my elbo behind my back and I can do the jujitsu wrist stretching excersises to a more extreme level than most others in class. Its like im flexible at the tips but not at all at the core.
I've found that eliminating unnecessary exertion is also effective at reducing injuries.
Heard something recently that suggested extending your range of motion alone doesn't help (maybe even makes you more susceptible), but pushing against the stretch to build strength athe same time seems to help a lot. I can relate personally, but would love to see solid evidence.
Nice, I wasn't doing that anyway
I’ve been working out for 25 years already believing this. I’ve never pulled a muscle doing bjj and downhill mtb.
Nice to see science backing my anecdotes.
Ive stuck with the guide: Some minor dynamic stetches are good. Then a good warmup. Then static stretching, or wait for them as part of the cool down.
Any time I try to stretch more than normal, I end up hurt. Maybe because I only do that when I expect to be pushed harder than normal.
I stick with this routine: every couple months, be reminded that my performance would be so much better if I was more flexible. Stretch regularly for 2 weeks. See no progress. Get distracted and forget about stretchingl
I cant find a definitive collection of peer reviewed material that says what stretching actually works. I just want to save money instead of buying a machine to suck my balls for me. Is that so much to ask?
im one of the types who injures myself stretching. and not becuase I push to much :)
I'm pretty sure I heard that stretching was a lesser but still beneficial alternative to exercise but that's been in my brain for a long time and I'm not able at this moment to track down a source of this claim.
It'll just do other things than other forms of exercise. Some train intensely for flexibility and so stretching is most of what they do! Most athletes except gymnasts, aerialists, etc don't have the same demand for flexibility and so don't need as much static stretching. But I think most people could benefit from a few stretches, especially as they get older.
I've always heard that people who consistently always stretch and people who consistently never stretch are injured at lower rates than people who inconsistently sometimes stretch. But I don't have a study to back this up
I'm inconsistently consistent, so I'm fucked.