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Ladybird, a truly independent web browser. (ladybird.org)
submitted 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago) by Blaze@lemmy.zip to c/linux@programming.dev
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Video announcement by Chris Wanstrath (GitHub co-founder) of the 501(c) non-profit and $1,000,000 donation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k9edTqPMX_k

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[-] rekabis@programming.dev 20 points 2 days ago

We don't have anyone actively working on Windows support, […] We would like to do Windows eventually, but it's not a priority at the moment.

As much as I applaud this focus on just one broad OS architecture, as it will greatly speed development, leaving out Windows is likely to cut off 85-90% of all early adopters. I just hope that the benefit of a simplified target will outweigh ignoring the vast majority of the market.

And honestly, methinks they should focus on Haiku OS before Windows, as it is closer to a Unix heritage than Windows is. And Haiku OS desperately needs a native modern web browser with all the bells and whistles.

[-] onlinepersona@programming.dev 29 points 3 days ago

I will never understand why people name stuff just by opening an English dictionary and simply picking a word.

Also why start a browser with C++? Google and Mozilla don't employ nincompoops to work on their browsers and still say 70% of their CVEs are due to memory management errors from C++. Instead of learning from that, they start yet another browser in C++.

In theory it great that this org wants to make an alternative, and probably being funded by a millionaire (billionaire?) can't hurt, but C++ man? Come on...

Anti Commercial-AI license

[-] vikingtons@lemmy.world 64 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago)

From.the FAQ

Why build a new browser in C++ when safer and more modern languages are available? Ladybird started as a component of the SerenityOS hobby project, which only allows C++. The choice of language was not so much a technical decision, but more one of personal convenience. Andreas was most comfortable with C++ when creating SerenityOS, and now we have almost half a million lines of modern C++ to maintain.

However, now that Ladybird has forked and become its own independent project, all constraints previously imposed by SerenityOS are no longer in effect. We are actively evaluating a number of alternatives and will be adding a mature successor language to the project in the near future. This process is already quite far along, and prototypes exist in multiple languages.

[-] SubArcticTundra@lemmy.ml 12 points 2 days ago

It's crazy that SerenityOS decided to re-write their everything from scratch, to suit them. I wish I coukd do that too, but I don't have the resources.

[-] onlinepersona@programming.dev 7 points 3 days ago

I hadn't seen that, thanks! That gives me a little hope.

Anti Commercial-AI license

[-] constableunstable@lemm.ee 6 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

I will never understand why people name stuff just by opening an English dictionary and simply picking a word

Naming stuff is hard.

[-] onlinepersona@programming.dev -4 points 2 days ago

Yeah, but not that hard.

  • La bird
  • BB.Bird (baby bird)
  • Birdanzo
  • Lanzango
  • Chicbee
  • Elburd (el bird)
  • Birday
  • Bowsun
  • Baysen
  • Lirsi
  • Slay BC

You can even put effort into it and look for translations in other languages, combine them, use a colloquialism not found in the standard dictionary, or so many other things.

Anti Commercial-AI license

[-] RootBeerGuy@discuss.tchncs.de 21 points 3 days ago

I mean, it is nice to have options. However, a first alpha release in 2026? That's more than a year away. A lot of stuff will happen until then, not unlikely that this gets stomped before that.

[-] compcube@lemy.lol 3 points 2 days ago

How exactly would it "get stomped", and by whom?

[-] Cube6392@beehaw.org 2 points 2 days ago

By whom is by google. How I don't know how to answer

[-] FizzyOrange@programming.dev 12 points 3 days ago

Yeah... It's going to take a whole lot more than $1m for this. I am skeptical.

Also not super enthused about another browser written in C++. I skimmed some of their code and it seems pretty high quality, but still... this is going to be chock full of security bugs.

Servo is definitely the more interesting project.

[-] Telorand@reddthat.com 19 points 2 days ago

They're already exploring other languages. C++ just happens be its origin by way of its heritage. It's not their target anymore.

Ultimately, we'll see what happens. I agree that $1mil isn't a ton for a big project, but we don't know, yet, if they'll be able to secure other big donations or not over the course of its life. People have sold stupider ideas to potential donors, so who knows?

[-] rekabis@programming.dev 8 points 2 days ago

Also not super enthused about another browser written in C++. I skimmed some of their code and it seems pretty high quality, but still… this is going to be chock full of security bugs.

If you are going to do anything stability-based these days, Rust should be a big consideration.

[-] rah@feddit.uk 8 points 3 days ago

Chris Wanstrath ... $1,000,000 donation

So.. not independent then.

[-] ipacialsection@startrek.website 29 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago)

The website claims that sponsors have no direct influence on the project ("board seats are not for sale"). The reality is that no project of sufficient scale to fully implement web standards can survive without a significant amount of funding.

[-] venoft@lemmy.world 1 points 2 days ago

Meanwhile on their website:

Chris Wanstrath (Secretary & Treasurer)

[-] cerement@slrpnk.net 23 points 3 days ago

from the FAQ

  • How can you be "independent" if you have sponsors?
  • All sponsorships are in the form of unrestricted donations. Board seats and other forms of influence are not for sale.
[-] bionicjoey@lemmy.ca 23 points 3 days ago

The threat of losing future donations if you upset a sponsor is still coercive.

[-] cerement@slrpnk.net 8 points 3 days ago

(sad part is even if they sold out, they’d still be leagues ahead of the compromises Firefox and Chrome have made)

[-] bolexforsoup@lemmy.blahaj.zone 13 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

I do not understand how folks like you get so shitty about Firefox taking Google money for making it a default search engine when that is the very clear, very limited extent of their relationship. This is the definition of “don’t let perfect be the enemy of good.” Because Firefox is pretty damn near perfect. I feel like I have to be missing something here.

What is the issue here? What compromises have they made that make them so irredeemable? If it’s the search default for google that’s just not sufficient IMO.

[-] cerement@slrpnk.net 6 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)
[-] bolexforsoup@lemmy.blahaj.zone 4 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

  • I am pro deplatforming.

  • I need to look into the finances more before drawing a conclusion. Not a good look at face value though.

  • let’s see the suit play out, but also concerning

  • don’t know enough about anonym but acquiring an ad-focused company is hardly an indictment

  • they reversed course on the Russia issue so that’s not an issue and should make you feel better. Their reasoning was also legitimate, even so good on them for realizing it was the wrong - if well intentioned - decision.

  • everyone is exploring AI who gives a shit. They’ve hardly forced it down our throats like everyone else.

With all of this in mind i’m down to be critical but this is not enough to warrant the hate.

[-] cerement@slrpnk.net 1 points 2 days ago

“I’m not mad, I’m just … disappointed.”

[-] bolexforsoup@lemmy.blahaj.zone 0 points 2 days ago

Don’t be an asshole

[-] zqwzzle@lemmy.ca 6 points 2 days ago

I thought this was the meta logo for a second.

[-] Blaze@lemmy.zip 3 points 3 days ago

Which immediately makes me asks which codes Firefox takes from Google

[-] noodlejetski@lemm.ee 52 points 3 days ago

Firefox is dependent on Google financially, not codeually.

[-] homesweethomeMrL@lemmy.world 23 points 3 days ago

“codeually” 😆

[-] jwt@programming.dev 2 points 2 days ago

Well obviously they're an expert in nameology.

[-] Blaze@lemmy.zip 3 points 3 days ago

Thanks!

[-] bolexforsoup@lemmy.blahaj.zone 17 points 3 days ago

Google pays Firefox a lot of money to make it the default search engine. It also takes like three clicks to swap it to DDG or something you prefer. If I were Mozilla/Firefox, I would take the money too lol

[-] spikespaz@programming.dev 1 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

Not a good first impression (other comments have my thoughts covered) and I think I'll stick with Firefox.

Unless they impress us by re-writing it in a quality-first language, and make all configuration declarative, and drop support for some cruft. They're going to have to try something bold and different to impress me, otherwise, this seems like more of the same, and an uphill battle at that.

this post was submitted on 01 Jul 2024
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