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A purported leak of 2,500 pages of internal documentation from Google sheds light on how Search, the most powerful arbiter of the internet, operates.

The leaked documents touch on topics like what kind of data Google collects and uses, which sites Google elevates for sensitive topics like elections, how Google handles small websites, and more. Some information in the documents appears to be in conflict with public statements by Google representatives, according to Fishkin and King.

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[-] woelkchen@lemmy.world 369 points 6 months ago

Some information in the documents appears to be in conflict with public statements by Google representatives

I would have never guessed that.

[-] applepie@kbin.social 117 points 6 months ago

At this point if you are not assuming that corporation is pretty much lying for convenience. you aint operating in reality haha

[-] trolololol@lemmy.world 45 points 6 months ago

Yep but I'll add my two cents, half is lying and half is guessfull ignorance because nobody really knows how big and old systems really work.

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[-] CosmoNova@lemmy.world 96 points 6 months ago

Crazy how self regulation always winds up like this. By crazy I mean predictable of course.

[-] SuckMyWang@lemmy.world 17 points 6 months ago
[-] barsquid@lemmy.world 32 points 6 months ago

Listen, the problem is too many regulations prevented the Invisible Hand from manifesting. If we remove even more regulations the free market will work this time, I swear.

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[-] cm0002@lemmy.world 22 points 6 months ago

Well I am just shocked, SHOCKED. Well, not that shocked.

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[-] flappy@lemm.ee 98 points 6 months ago

Can't wait for selfhosted web search to become better.

[-] jonne@infosec.pub 62 points 6 months ago

You mean hosting your own crawler/indexer? That doesn't really sound like a thing you could do cost-effectively.

[-] interdimensionalmeme@lemmy.ml 62 points 6 months ago

No problem we crowdsource the crawling torrent style.

We outsourced that to google for reasonnable performance reason. But they shit the bed so now there's no choice but to do it ourselves.

[-] bamfic@lemmy.world 11 points 6 months ago

ooh that might be an interesting app to run on veilid

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[-] zutto@lemmy.fedi.zutto.fi 19 points 6 months ago

Surprisingly, it's very doable, requires basic technical knowledge and relatively minimal computing resources (runs in the background on your computer).

https://yacy.net/ Github

I have tampermonkey script that sends yacy to crawl any websites that I visit, and it's keeping up relatively good index for personal use of the visited websites. Combine yacy with ~300gb of Kiwix databases, add searxng as a frontend and you have pretty strong self hosted search engine.

Of course you need to supplement your searches from other search engines, as yacy does not crawl the whole web, just what you tell it to.

I encourage anyone who's even slightly interested on this stuff to try Yacy, it's ancient piece of software, but it still works very well and is not an abandoned project yet!

--

I personally use Yacy mostly on private mode, but it does have the distributed network there as well. Yacy current freeworld status

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[-] brbposting@sh.itjust.works 16 points 6 months ago

Right!

Before his company was able to block more of Microsoft's own tracking scripts, DuckDuckGo CEO and founder Gabriel Weinberg explained in a Reddit reply why firms like his weren't going the full DIY route:

“… [W]e source most of our traditional links and images privately from Bing … Really only two companies (Google and Microsoft) have a high-quality global web link index (because I believe it costs upwards of a billion dollars a year to do), and so literally every other global search engine needs to bootstrap with one or both of them to provide a mainstream search product. The same is true for maps btw -- only the biggest companies can similarly afford to put satellites up and send ground cars to take streetview pictures of every neighborhood.”

Ars

[-] warmaster@lemmy.world 16 points 6 months ago
[-] Paradox 54 points 6 months ago

Federated directories. We're going back to Yahoo like it's 1995

[-] NoIWontPickAName@kbin.earth 32 points 6 months ago
[-] AbidanYre@lemmy.world 19 points 6 months ago

<under_construction.gif>

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[-] Jako301@feddit.de 17 points 6 months ago

How is that even supposed to work? These search engines need per definition massive databanks to search through. Either you need your own crawler and indexer which is more than just inefficient, or you are limited to a relatively short list of curated static results.

[-] Peppycito@sh.itjust.works 12 points 6 months ago

If they're taking tips from Google, why would they get better?

[-] FaceDeer@fedia.io 32 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

Google actually was good, so there's probably some good information in this documentation. If nothing else we can perhaps figure out what "went wrong."

Edit: I've been reading the blog post that appears to be the main person the leak was shared with and there's a lot of in-depth analysis being done there, but I'm not seeing a link to the actual documents. This is a huge article, though, I might be overlooking it.

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[-] mlg@lemmy.world 85 points 6 months ago

Google has been pretty crap for a decade now.

I still remember demoing how easily they can manipulate people by searching "Pakistan News" and the results being exclusively all Indian media outlet propaganda way back in 2016.

I really feel like they never got properly exposed for this just because it's a search engine and not a social media, so people didn't care enough about it. Also because Google was still top of the game in most results compared to other sites back then.

[-] SirEDCaLot@lemmy.today 17 points 6 months ago

My thought exactly. If this was back in like 2010, it would be a real oh shit moment, The key to the kingdom has been leaked. Now I don't think anybody really cares other than SEO spammers who will game the system even more than they already are.

Google search is crap and has been crap for some time. Not sure any others are better. But it started going downhill with the Google Plus social network, when they removed "+" as a search operator so you could better search for 'Google+' that was the first time they messed with Search to further some other business goal. It wasn't the last time. Back when Google was good, they publicly said their goal was to get you off their site as fast as possible. Now the results reek of engagement algorithm bullshit.

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[-] deweydecibel@lemmy.world 79 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

Rand Fishkin, who worked in SEO for more than a decade, says a source shared 2,500 pages of documents with him with the hopes that reporting on the leak would counter the “lies” that Google employees had shared about how the search algorithm works.

Am I supposed to care that the poor SEO assholes that need to get their ads more visibility weren't being given all the instructions on how to do that by the search engine?

Most of this article is SEO "experts" complaining that some of the guidelines they were given didn't match what's in the internal documents.

Google is shit, but SEO is a cancer too. I can't be too bothered by Google jacking them around a bit.

[-] lvxferre@mander.xyz 31 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

And I supposed to care that the poor SEO assholes that need to get their ads more visibility weren’t being given all the instructions on how to do that by the search engine?

No. You're supposed to care that a company is pointlessly* lying, thus it's extremely likely to deceive, mislead and lie when it gets some benefit out of it.

In other words: SEO arseholes can ligma, Google is lying to you and me too.

*I say "pointlessly" because not disclosing info would achieve practically the same result as lying.

[-] brbposting@sh.itjust.works 24 points 6 months ago

need to get their ads more visibility

I occasionally encounter the desire for a search engine to surface non-advertisement content :)

Now if they lied to advertisers and told small bloggers, reputable news agencies, fediverse admins, etc. the insider secrets… now we’re talkin’!

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[-] NutWrench@lemmy.world 68 points 6 months ago

Here's the sooper-secret search result algorithm for whatever you type into Google:

YouTube results, followed by Reddit results, followed by "Sponsored" results, followed by AI-written Bot results, then a couple pages of Amazon results and finally, on page 10 or so, a ten-year-old result that's probably no longer relevant.

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[-] pyre@lemmy.world 63 points 6 months ago

awesome, now we can make our own search engine that is filled with complete trash and isn't concerned with helping the user at all.

[-] iopq@lemmy.world 52 points 6 months ago

I want a federated social bookmarking site. Not for news or discussion of recent stuff, but to keep some good sites in your account and to share with others.

Searching those and getting results with attached upvotes/downvotes would be ideal

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[-] nick@midwest.social 46 points 6 months ago

Now, where to download these, for science.

[-] Tronn4@lemmy.world 27 points 6 months ago

Use Bing 😅😅

[-] NoIWontPickAName@kbin.earth 19 points 6 months ago
[-] douglasg14b@lemmy.world 44 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

Where can one get a hold of these documents?

This appears to be the original blog post, but I'm not finding a way to download this. https://sparktoro.com/blog/an-anonymous-source-shared-thousands-of-leaked-google-search-api-documents-with-me-everyone-in-seo-should-see-them/

Is this not leaked past this one person?

Edit 2: No, these appear to be normal public docs.

Edit: seems these are the docs? https://hexdocs.pm/google_api_content_warehouse/0.4.0/GoogleApi.ContentWarehouse.V1.Model.QualityNavboostCrapsCrapsData.html

[-] Danterious@lemmy.dbzer0.com 40 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

I guess we are going to be in for more SEO spam than usual if this document is accurate. But I think its good that we are finally going to get a better understanding how Google manipulates people with the algorithm.

So a win-lose situation.

~Anti~ ~Commercial-AI~ ~license~ ~(CC~ ~BY-NC-SA~ ~4.0)~

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[-] w2tpmf@lemmy.world 39 points 6 months ago

Who wants to take bets that Search itself ends up in The Graveyard soon, leaving nothing but the new AI abomination in place?

[-] kshade@lemmy.world 11 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

I could see them not letting you directly search anymore, only through the LLM bot. Because that's been how things have been going anyway, Google seems to fully ignore literal searches with quote marks now, presumably because it doesn't fit their vision of using natural (imprecise) language. So why not make the LLM write the search query for you in a completely opaque way?

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[-] b3an@lemmy.world 33 points 6 months ago

Honestly I hope this bites them hard. They've done way way worse to small businesses and competition for decades now.

[-] dojan@lemmy.world 23 points 6 months ago

It's honestly quite strange that this sort of black box system is allowed to exist. How are governments around the world OK with a vast majority of the internet being filtered through a private company's lens without any sort of insight into how it works? That sounds skeevy as shit.

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[-] postmateDumbass@lemmy.world 20 points 6 months ago

I tried to cry for them but after Googling instructions about how to I poured Elmer's Wood Glue on both eyes. I cannot call the result tears. Not sure what to call it, but certainly not tears.

[-] muntedcrocodile@lemm.ee 17 points 6 months ago* (last edited 6 months ago)

Someone got a torrent for us?

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[-] SharkAttak@kbin.social 14 points 6 months ago

"How does Google's search algorithm works? -reddit"
The algorithm works with the use of proprietary tchnology.. (read 2500 pages more)

[-] autotldr@lemmings.world 13 points 6 months ago

This is the best summary I could come up with:


But how exactly Google ranks websites has long been a mystery, pieced together by journalists, researchers, and people working in search engine optimization.

Now, an explosive leak that purports to show thousands of pages of internal documents appears to offer an unprecedented look under the hood of how Search works — and suggests that Google hasn’t been entirely truthful about it for years.

“While I don’t necessarily fault Google’s public representatives for protecting their proprietary information, I do take issue with their efforts to actively discredit people in the marketing, tech, and journalism worlds who have presented reproducible discoveries.”

Fishkin told The Verge in an email that the company has not disputed the veracity of the leak, but that an employee asked him to change some language in the post regarding how an event was characterized.

The pervasive, often annoying tactics have led to a general narrative that Google Search results are getting worse, crowded with junk that website operators feel required to produce to have their sites seen.

The US government’s antitrust case against Google — which revolves around Search — has also led to internal documentation becoming public, offering further insights into how the company’s main product works.


The original article contains 906 words, the summary contains 200 words. Saved 78%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!

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this post was submitted on 28 May 2024
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