Thoughts on these SATA/M.2-->SATA/2.5" adapters? (feddit.nl)

submitted 1 month ago by helenslunch@feddit.nl to c/selfhosted@lemmy.world

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Trying to squeeze some more storage in my MiniPC. I have questions about these. These use hardward RAID with selectable modes (Individual/JBOD/RAID1/RAID2).

If I use RAID 1 and one of the drives fails, will I know?
If a drive fails, and a slap in a new one, will it internally begin repairing RAID 1 again?
Can I use these as "individual" or JBOD and have 2 separate drives through the same connector, and use something like TrueNAS to software-RAID them?

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[-] scrubbles@poptalk.scrubbles.tech 25 points 1 month ago

Neat, but I see it personally as the worst of both worlds, unless you have a bunch of NVMEs sitting around.

You're going to be bottlenecked by SATA speeds, so even one NVME would be bottlenecked, let alone 2. So for me, going with a larger SATA SSD (which you could of course RAID with another) would probably get you still better speeds.

Then you have issue of it breaking. Personally, I have never had good luck with secondary board RAID items like this. They always fail after a while. The only stable raids I have seen are motherboards and SAS. Whenever I see "Make this interface into another RAID" I think of the.... 5-7 failed cards sitting behind me.

[-] helenslunch@feddit.nl 4 points 1 month ago

unless you have a bunch of NVMEs sitting around.

SATA, not NVMe.

You're going to be bottlenecked by SATA speeds

Speed is not a concern for me.

[-] scrubbles@poptalk.scrubbles.tech 3 points 1 month ago

If you don't have a bunch of nvmes lying around that you want to use, then why not just go for a few sata drives and raid those together? You do what you like, to me that just seems like more storage for your buck

[-] helenslunch@feddit.nl 1 points 1 month ago

I don't have any way to add them.

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[-] mbfalzar@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 1 month ago

Just as an uninvolved third party, I'm trying to figure out how NVMe entered this response to a question about a SATA to SATA form factor converter

[-] accideath@lemmy.world 2 points 1 month ago

Because M.2 equals NVMe in some people’s minds, I suppose

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[-] slacktoid@lemmy.ml 4 points 1 month ago

M.2 is a form factor. Under that form factor it can run the NVMe or the SATA protocol.

[-] scrubbles@poptalk.scrubbles.tech 1 points 1 month ago

Answered elsewhere in this thread. Yes, I'm aware, but the only real life use case is plugging in nvme drives

[-] slacktoid@lemmy.ml 3 points 1 month ago

There are m.2 sata drives. They have a different pin layout and everything. It depends on what you want out of the QoS of your system and what bottlenecks you have.

[-] scrubbles@poptalk.scrubbles.tech 1 points 1 month ago

Yeah, just then I still think it's the worst of both worlds. You still have a single point of failure, that raid controller on that device probably can't be ported anywhere else (at least most of the cheap controllers I've seen haven't been able to, most mobo raids I've been able to recover), and so if you don't have redundancy anyway, then a larger SSD is to me, the way to go. Honestly a single SSD and a nightly backup to an external would be how I'd do it if I was on a budget and only had one SATA port remaining.

[-] slacktoid@lemmy.ml 3 points 1 month ago

Yeah thats the problem with hardware raid in general.

[-] bonus_crab@lemmy.world 2 points 1 month ago

also nvme drives get HOT, and sticking em together in an enclosure with no heatsink or fan would probably have thermal throttle under load.

[-] BigMikeInAustin@lemmy.world 6 points 1 month ago

I'm not saying this rudely. This sounds like a "read the manual" moment, since different vendors can have different settings.

Or at least links to the exact one you are looking at.

[-] helenslunch@feddit.nl 0 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

I couldn't find any manuals. Nothing that referenced my questions. Thought maybe there was just a "conventional" way that these functioned.

[-] AmbroisindeMontaigu@kbin.social 2 points 1 month ago

https://www.qnap.com/en/product/qda-a2mar seems to be the one in your image. From the users guide it seems it does everything you listed. The prices I've seen are about 100 € / $ though plus the two SSDs you need, personally I'd invest in external backup instead, that covers more data loss scenarios than this adapter.

[-] helenslunch@feddit.nl 0 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

That's cool that it has a utility but how would I even access that on a server? And how would I be notified if there was a problem?

External backup is not a possibility.

[-] uninvitedguest@lemmy.ca 6 points 1 month ago

Super cool. I didn't know this existed.

[-] poVoq@slrpnk.net 4 points 1 month ago

Very likely no (but maybe some SMART data?)
Probably only if it is the identical model, but depends on the the exact implementation I guess
Probably if it claims to support them as individual drives, but you will be still limited to the speed of a single SATA3 connection.

[-] mathers@l.mathers.fr 2 points 1 month ago

Since you mentioned that speed wasn't a concern, I would go with software raid, which would also alleviate your concerns about 1 and 2.

[-] Hiro8811@lemmy.world 2 points 1 month ago

If I'm not wrong these are not compatible with nvme? I remember I wanted to buy something like this but I couldn't find PCIE to SATA, pretty sure I'm wrong but not in the mood to research

[-] helenslunch@feddit.nl 1 points 1 month ago

This one is SATA, yes.

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[-] Ebby@lemmy.ssba.com 1 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

IIR there are 2 versions, one using SATA protocol and the other using PCIe. The difference is keyed into cutouts between pins.

I'm not entirely sure what the benefit of this setup would be over 2 independent SSD's since one drive will max out the connection speed and 2 can use 2 ports.

I've had a 2x SATA-based m.2 RAID card that plugged into PCIe for a boost in speed ages ago. It was fun, but I swapped it out for true PCIe based m.2.

[-] bassomitron@lemmy.world 3 points 1 month ago

I think their goal is to minimize space since it's a mini-pc, so they don't have 2 slots to spare but still want 2 drives? That's how I interpreted it, at least.

[-] Ebby@lemmy.ssba.com 1 points 1 month ago

Ahh good point.

Heat may be an issue if it is very cramped, but could work. Letting the motherboard handle raid would be better, but add one heck of a bottleneck. I'm still leaning towards one large SSD or perhaps external storage.

A video archive on external would work fine for a couple users, but sharing disk bandwidth with the system would suck pretty fast.

[-] helenslunch@feddit.nl 1 points 1 month ago

Heat may be an issue if it is very cramped

There is a fan for the SSD.

I'm still leaning towards one large SSD

Then there's no redundancy.

or perhaps external storage.

I have no way to add external storage. It's my understanding that USB storage does not work well.

[-] bassomitron@lemmy.world 1 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Have you considered SD card(s) as your redundancy? They're not great/ideal, but microSD are incredibly small. Or this may be a good use case for a local NAS placed somewhere else in your home that your PC backs up to nightly?

[-] helenslunch@feddit.nl 1 points 1 month ago

I'm not entirely sure what the benefit of this setup would be over 2 independent SSD's

The benefit is that I don't have anywhere to connect 2 SSDs, much less M.2

[-] Ebby@lemmy.ssba.com 2 points 1 month ago

Gotcha. I missed that one. :)

[-] aard@kyu.de 2 points 1 month ago

JBOD relies on an optional SATA extension, which most of your controllers won't have.

That leaves you with RAID in the controller - which is a bad idea, as you don't have much control over what is going on, and recovery if it fails will possibly messy.

[-] helenslunch@feddit.nl 1 points 1 month ago

Then why does it list JBOD?

[-] aard@kyu.de 1 points 1 month ago

Because it does JBOD if the controller supports it. Pretty much none of the controllers you'll find in consumer hardware support that.

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[-] 01189998819991197253@infosec.pub 2 points 1 month ago

TIL these exist. Neat.

[-] helenslunch@feddit.nl 5 points 1 month ago

You're neat

[-] altima_neo@lemmy.zip 2 points 1 month ago

I cant see these being great if all youre doing is trying to add more storage. For one, raid is already not terribly great, and on some unknown hardware like this, who knows?

If all you needed was storage, youd be better off getting an actual 2.5" drive in the highest capacity you can find, and it will still likely be cheaper thank a bunch of M.2 and perform better too.

[-] helenslunch@feddit.nl 0 points 1 month ago

Then there's no redundancy

[-] Kidplayer_666@lemm.ee 1 points 1 month ago

Question, where did you find these?

[-] helenslunch@feddit.nl 1 points 1 month ago

Amazon. QNAP and StarTech Make them.

[-] aBundleOfFerrets@sh.itjust.works 1 points 1 month ago

Why not ask QNAP or StarTech support about how they operate then?

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[-] possiblylinux127@lemmy.zip 1 points 1 month ago

Do not use one with any kind of logic. The mSATA ones are fine because they just passthough

[-] helenslunch@feddit.nl 0 points 1 month ago

Logic?

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[-] Decronym@lemmy.decronym.xyz 0 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

Acronyms, initialisms, abbreviations, contractions, and other phrases which expand to something larger, that I've seen in this thread:

Fewer Letters	More Letters
NAS	Network-Attached Storage
NVMe	Non-Volatile Memory Express interface for mass storage
PCIe	Peripheral Component Interconnect Express
RAID	Redundant Array of Independent Disks for mass storage
SATA	Serial AT Attachment interface for mass storage
SSD	Solid State Drive mass storage

[Thread #660 for this sub, first seen 6th Apr 2024, 21:05] [FAQ] [Full list] [Contact] [Source code]

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this post was submitted on 06 Apr 2024

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