For posting all the anonymous reactionary bullshit that you can't post anywhere else.
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Impact of the Democratic primaries: MS Now has been cutting back and forth to this bland-looking chart comparing democratic socialism to communism
Are they wrong though? "social democracy is objectively the moderate wing of fascism" and all that.
now they should post home ownership rates between the commie countries and the sucdem/demsoc countries.
democratic socialism
private home and business ownership
ok so that's just capitalism, I hope you guys know that
WHERE are they pretending to get this information from? you can't just unquestionably shout unsourced shit with the justification 'idk lol vibes' and expect anyone to listen to you
I think they can
Yeah, if their liberal audience is reading things they agree with they won't stop to ask for sources. Communism = authoritarian by default.
In contrast, most communists have had their worldview shaken to the core. This lends itself to healthy skepticism about political/economic beliefs such that new beliefs require more justification. Which doesn't make all our political/economic beliefs correct--we don't all agree, after all--but we will at least point to some historical or theoretical evidence to back up our views.
They are completely politically illiterate, none of them knows what any of these words mean. It's like watching children pretending they're grown-ups.
Capitalism can be reformed
The Manifesto is like 40 pages and even has a very simple list. They really cannot read can they.
Nevertheless, in most advanced countries, the following will be pretty generally applicable.
- Abolition of property in land and application of all rents of land to public purposes.
- A heavy progressive or graduated income tax.
- Abolition of all rights of inheritance.
- Confiscation of the property of all emigrants and rebels.
- Centralisation of credit in the hands of the state, by means of a national bank with State capital and an exclusive monopoly.
- Centralisation of the means of communication and transport in the hands of the State.
- Extension of factories and instruments of production owned by the State; the bringing into cultivation of waste-lands, and the improvement of the soil generally in accordance with a common plan.
- Equal liability of all to work. Establishment of industrial armies, especially for agriculture.
- Combination of agriculture with manufacturing industries; gradual abolition of all the distinction between town and country by a more equable distribution of the populace over the country.
- Free education for all children in public schools. Abolition of children’s factory labour in its present form. Combination of education with industrial production
Very insightful
I think even DSA is mostly on board with the 10 points
Number 6 is problematic for me. The state can control transport routes, but not all transport ation in general. Also, there should be private comm options, with many frequecies available for private users like HAM folks. I also want a private option or two for phones and maybe a state-ran, open source OS for mobile that is privacy respecting.
That's just soc dem. Socialism requires building the conditions to end capitalism
I've already depicted you as the column with "bad stuff" and me as the column with "good stuff".
Once again making me yearn for the day that a communist can just flippantly say shit about capitalism and then the institutions around them do not budge.
"Oh, you want capitalism? So you think it's good when people drop nuclear bombs?"
"I get why you'd want capitalism, but I just don't think it's worth it to spend the finite resources on Earth on genocide though."
"It's okay to not like your manager, it's another thing entirely to arbitrarily split up and duplicate work so that you can gamble on a better boss. If they're really that bad, you'll all vote them out."
"The workplace isn't just for gambling with money, you know. People work there and actually help society."
"Oh, the reclaimed forest is taking up real estate? You want the trees to start paying rent? You want the tree money to buy politicians?"
The smarmy, smug shit I would say if I were simply given with power instead of having to be evaluated by LOSERS.
"Capitalism sounds good on paper but every time it's been tried it failed because of human nature"
I have actually used this one lmao
"Capitalism doesn't even work on paper. Obviously, communism is the better system." (A line I have used in response to "communism only works on paper".)
(I love the idea of a world in which socialism has become the default and capitalism is treated the way current Red Scare bullcrap treats "Scary Evil Communism".)
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"The problem with capitalism is that eventually you run out of other people's resources"
"Why would you want capitalism? People starve and live on the streets in capitalist countries!"
"Alex, finish your meatloaf. There are poor kids your age starving in a capitalist country."
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The democratic socialism column disagrees with DSA's platform in some key ways. In particular, DSA explicitly states capitalism needs to be replaced with socialism.
I was going to say; the last one is the bright dividing line between social democrats and democratic socialists.
Cool, I'll take the communism option please.
It sounds so much better even in their propaganda example.
Notice how they never actually talk about whether these are actually effective strategies for improving society, it's entirely vibes based. You must not think about what works, only what feels good. Consume. Don't think.
Social democracy. The term you're looking for is social democracy
Everybody wants to look better than they are:
Social democrats: Look, we're demsocs!
Liberal-Conservatives: Look, we're social democrats!
Fascists: Look, we're liberal-conservatives!
Encyclopedia - Nota bene: 'Econoclard' is an extra-pejorative form of the already pejorative name 'Mazovian Economists', a moderate school of Mazovianism, which advocates a gradual transition to communism through carefully managed economic modernisation rather than violent social revolution.
Steban, the Student Communist - "They're by far the most bean-centric school of communism."
Empathy - Ah yes, the much maligned bean counters, ensconced in their think-tanks and highrises, believing they can save the world through a series of incremental, assiduously technocratic reforms...
You - "What's wrong with making progress through moderate economic reforms?"
Steban, the Student Communist - "Oh, please. There's nothing 'moderate' about their love for counting beans. If I were a Gottwaldian, I would probably diagnose them with Bohnenfixierung..."
Steban, the Student Communist - "You see, Econoclards claim to be communists, but in reality they're just liberals with hard-ons for spreadsheets."
You - "And what about the liberals? Are they liberals, too?"
Steban, the Student Communist - "Of course not. The only people who actually call themselves liberals are mouth-foaming reactionaries."
Echo Maker - "Basically indistinguishable from fascists. You'd need an x-ray machine to tell the difference."
It's a distinction without a difference really.
"Authoritarian" is when billionaires have their wage-slaves taken away from them. I am very smart.
Same vibe 
What I always liked about this meme is that it includes Luxemburg and Trotsky who both supported Lenin, and would have used similar measures as him.
I mean Trotsky was instrumental in a lot of authoritarian, anti-democratic stuff. He was in charge of crushing the Kronstadt Rebellion ffs. You can argue one way or the other about a lot of it, but his recasting as 'the nice one' is utterly ludicrous
Trotsky was an opportunist who quickly flipped to whatever position was expedient. He was in both the right and left oppositions, back and forth. He was whatever he needed to be.
Marx also hated succs and social chauvinists and openly shat upon them constantly. These people clearly never read Marx. They had Bernie-types in his day too and ripped them into pieces.
Given that authoritarian means "theres laws and they are enforced" which is true of both of these columns, yeah the communism sounds pretty good to me. Why let things like train tickets or computers be market set prices when they could be government set? And why would I want private home ownership? If youre in favor of private hone ownership and homes as investment, youre in favor of the social murder of homeless people. I dont want people to die, so homes cannot be investment or privately owned and sold/traded on a market. And yes, incentivizing individualism does harm the working class. Suck my taint land~~lords~~scums and bootstrap believers, take a long walk off a short pier.
The Communists disdain to conceal their views and aims. They openly declare that incentivizing individualism fails the working class and must be stopped.
Wow this communism thing looks pretty good, thank you MS Now!
Really falls apart at the end there, just repeating 'no incentivizing the individual,' like when you ran out of things you knew about the topic in a high school essay
The libs admit the DSA is little more than a radlib organization and so called "demsocs" are nothing more than turbolibs
"The opponents of DSA define it to hold a position other than what DSA says it holds, and I somehow think this is 'admitting' something."
capitalism can be reformed to create social safety nets
This is such blatant redefining of "democratic socialism" into social democracy.
That's because it is. It's only yankkks that like to call social democracy "democratic socialism"
Nonetheless, DSA explicitly states that their goal is to replace capitalism with socialism. Their program asks people to imagine a world without capitalism.
DSA is the boogey man they're pointing and DSA is clear that their democratic socialism is about ending capitalism and building socialism.
Claiming Democratic socialism has "free and fair elections" is laughable after the shit we've witnessed the past decade. Shit's gonna backfire on them when they're laughed it off the room saying this stuff.
I mean, this is very much my experience with DSA-types. Its libs that want social safety nets. Still a nice thing to vote for, but absolutely not what I would call socialist.
I’ve met a lot of different DSA members that range wildly. It depends on the person and on the local chapter.
My local chapter has a bunch of Marxist Leninists in the leadership and a reading list indistinguishable from the reading list on this site.
That philosophy part of the graphic also goes directly against DSA’s official position, which is to abolish capitalism.
Honestly, even this much is more acceptance that I could have imagined 10 years ago. 10 years from now? A table of Posadism vs. Stalinism.