Ask Lemmy

problem is OP you don't just bring down/destroy/disappear capitalism

capitalism is an umbrella term for the economic system that emerged from the most basic early trade/money systems/financialisation

so in reality you start with capitalism and change it to enable things you like

anyone that doesn't start answering your question with capitalism is a bullshit fantasist

judging by the other replies you've had that's what you got. that's why these transition plans to communism are so threadbare and disfunctional. they are just hand-wavey dreams

Socialism, Syndicalism, im fine with either. But this time PUT GUARD RAILS UP SO NO ONE FUCKER CAN JUST GRAB POWER AND RUIN THE DEMOCRACY!

Production caps, energy expenditure caps, more efficient redistribution systems. Basically "produce what we need and then stop." Redirect energy from acquiring more resources to developing intellectual thought and artistic talent.

I've asked this multiple times and no one ever has an answer.

In the end nothing works because humans are terrible, and the terrible ones always gain power. Capitalism at least works for some people. Communism is easily harnessed by a small power group to starve everyone and have them live terrible lives.

I'd actually be all for just keeping this current system, put in Norway style socialism for taking care of sick poor and old, tax billionaires 99%, and make money in politics illegal. Oh and outlaw controlled centralized social media while we're at it.

I am not for a system that gives everyone everything. The lazy shit heads are gonna sit on their butts smoking weed all day and playing cod when they could be providing work for society. I know many people like this. There still needs to be people who do the real work or you're not going to have power or heat, good luck surviving that! But we could also change to a 30 hr work week easily for many jobs.

Shit isn't binary...

The current situation doesn't have to be the only economy we can have where people earn and spend money.

People would just have basic needs met and work for extras. When people got sick, they'd get healthcare. When theyre young, they'd get an education.

Surface level shit would look the same as it did 30 years ago, it just wouldn't actually be rotten at the core

how do we ensure human nature doesnt juat exploit it for a few individuals benefit

So how to avoid the history of all governments ever created?

Socialism. True economic and political democracy, that isn't managed by capitalists, landlords, or other centralised powerful groups, and where elections are not won by money.

It really is as simple as that. These comments are baffling. We can't have Norway or Switzerland globally, that is possible only by continuing to rely on the poverty of the global south.

Rojava/DNAS has some good ideas.

I think there will be a sudden abundance when food waste is distributed instead of landfilled, housing is rent free and not locked away as an investment.

Most of the systems that make society function are already not profit motivated so most will continue to function in transition. We see this happen every natural disaster, the workers of a critical facility sticking through because their work is meaningful.

Won't be totally comfortable but i disagree with the opinion it will be a death sentence for many.

Capitalism+. Every business must be majority owned by their workers.

Simple, you replace it with socialism. That doesn't mean history just ends and there's nothing else to worry about in the future. Suppose "human nature" just exploits the system and ends up with a few party elites benefiting - so? Is it worse than what we have? Will the new elite be able to hold on to power permanently without offering the mass of the people concessions?

The first real liberal revolution ended with an empire, but the empire was still better than the old regime that the revolution overthrew, and it spread liberal ideas throughout Europe. Then Napoleon was defeated and there was a reactionary monarchist restoration, which was overthrown and replaced with a constitutional monarchy in under 20 years. The constitutional monarchy was itself overthrown and replaced with a second republic less than 20 years after that. Then there was an imperial restoration under a lesser Napoleon, who went on to lose a war and get overthrown, replaced with a third Republic. They're on the fourth Republic now, but they haven't had a monarch since 1870 or a king since 1848. I would say the chances of France undergoing a monarchist restoration at this point are very low.

At no point in this process was "it" over. It's not over now. Maybe something is over, but that something stopped being "it", and was replaced by a new "it".

This whole thread is just so adorable.

Capitalism > democratic socialism > socialism > communism > anarchism. That is my head cannon.

I actually love the thought of protecting us from humanity itself. Its kinda the "human nature is inherently selfish" idea. Which i disagree with. Here are some links that might heko you feel the same

https://youtu.be/rP1_cyxD1LA

https://pca.st/episode/1b0edfd7-89f4-48d5-ae23-f67fea46a41

However, if you are still not cinvinced; I think you could draw a lot of strength from the idea of: "the dictatorship of the proletariat".

Creating a system which prevents the worse characteristics of human nature from thriving, is a must. That must happen in order to achieve communism

Well, the best countries to live in tend to be socialist democracies with a strong capitalist free market and social safety net. Maybe the problem isn't capitalism, but the form of government.

ANARCHY!!!!

https://youtu.be/cLBospQs9Hk

IMO our population is already too high to be sustainable without capitalism grinding people down to survive off their blood and suffering. We would need to heavily automate most of the labour intensive industries like mining and especially farming; however, I don't think this will happen any time soon, partially in thanks to how the current system maintains the status quo and is very much regressive in that respect. There's a steep curve to get over to achieve this technologically, and I don't think we're that close to implementing it on such a massive scale to be effective.

I know of a few companies that are working on these issues; like one company that uses special suction cups on robotic arms to pick fruit and maybe humanoid robots will become rugged enough for continuous outdoor labour but from what I see and the amount of people working on this issue, I don't think we're even close.

We're all trapped in this horrible machine, and the machine is bleeding to death.

*Especially because AIs are too inaccurate and energy intensive to be useful... it was a good idea but in practice, it's basically useless.

*Also I don't believe it's human nature to exploit other people, just how the current system works I guess. Human nature is picking berries, hunting animals, taking your kid fishing and just chilling with your community. I think your idea about human nature is skewed because very few people are able to experience a healthy community.

I imagine if we get rid of it, we'll just muck about until we reinvent it under a new name. After all, as far as I can tell capitalism is damn close to feudalism. I'm sure there are technical differences, like you own wealth instead of land, but the end result looks pretty similar.

Step one – eradicate humans.

Using fossil fuels to make fertilizer has fueled human growth.

When capitalism dies, a LOT of people die off. It is inevitable - eventually we have to wean off of oil, and it isn't just transport but materials and fertilizers.

So we have to plan for a smaller world community as well, and help those in crisis as the world community shrinks.

I guess send a bunch of people to forced labour camps ?