Would be really helpful if explained in Marxist terms, especially whether first world capital/superprofits are diverted to Israel in amounts not earned by providing services to power, or having Israel around is unprofitable/counterproductive to US aims/interests. Do other countries experience the same?

top 11 comments

sorted by: hot top controversial new old

[–] leftAF@hexbear.net 4 points 16 hours ago (1 children)

I'm assuming this is with regards to Israel. It's true in the sense that Israel is supported with billions in cash, arms transfers, logistics, and diplomatic cover and in return elements of the ruling class both in that country and which straddle it and others interfere in US elections in favor of those who facilitate that status quo.

It's a feedback loop like many situations, and there may be a tipping point where the US government tries to credibly round up Mossad and try to blame Israel for official actions of our state - but I've always figured that'd only happen when Nuremberg 2 is at hand.

[–] Fingernail2@hexbear.net 1 points 14 hours ago* (last edited 14 hours ago) (1 children)

elements of the ruling class both in that country and which straddle it and others interfere in US elections in favor of those who facilitate that status quo.

But what does this mean? Do the Israeli bourgeoisie, via the Israeli state, exert enough control over the US state to divert superprofits/capital to Israel that it hasn't earned in terms of services to power.

[–] leftAF@hexbear.net 1 points 14 hours ago (1 children)

I'd say Adelson and Bibi's relationship with Trump and our Congress causes inflation in our lives in excess of whatever "benefit" to imperialism Israel provides. I don't know that Israel as a whole truly benefits, I'd say not really as they're turning it into a coffin with one predictable exit. Purely in terms of profit? Probably not really. Many Israeli military actions in the region have been motivated partly by the manipulation of the price of oil (which had to be bought with dollars for nearly a century and so on). I'm really stoned right now but I think it might be self-evident that insider knowledge about oil futures and such isn't beneficial to the whole of the US society, and I personally doubt very many of the people making these decisions really have any national interests at heart.

[–] Fingernail2@hexbear.net 1 points 14 hours ago

Many Israeli military actions in the region have been motivated partly by the manipulation of the price of oil (which had to be bought with dollars

Interesting.

[–] queermunist@lemmy.ml 3 points 16 hours ago (2 children)

I think Israel is better understood as an extension of the US. Israel's policy is US policy, they are one.

[–] ClimateStalin@hexbear.net 4 points 15 hours ago* (last edited 15 hours ago) (3 children)

My only problem with this idea is that the US treats Israel and Israelis far better than it treats America and Americans.

The US federal government would never, in the modern day, give the level of support it gives Israel to Louisiana. Louisiana barely has schools, Israel has universal healthcare.

[–] queermunist@lemmy.ml 1 points 5 hours ago

Israel needs this level of support to even exist, whereas Louisiana can be neglected and it will continue to be a state. The US is always giving the leastal amount of support possible for its various territories.

The fact that Israel needs so much support just highlights how fragile it really is.

[–] Fingernail2@hexbear.net 4 points 15 hours ago* (last edited 15 hours ago)

Everyone has to join the military in Israel and take turns guarding the world's biggest concentration camp, possibly becoming 🔻 in the process. The American troops in Israel also get healthcare, even if it probably sucks, but they don't have to go actively carry out the genocide.

Edit: I think part of the belief stems from an idea that Israel receives capital that is undeserved/could be better put to work elsewhere—ie impoverished US communities. But Louisiana isn't a linchpin of empire, it's a sacrifice zone, and I imagine that if the capital didn't go to Israel it would be used for another form of imperialism, not free healthcare in LA.

[–] electric_nan@lemmy.ml 2 points 15 hours ago

I think the US provides Israel a lot of indulgences. Israel gets things that the US doesn't have partly because it's cheaper to provide them to a small state, but more importantly because they have to provide them. It is part of what props up the state of Israel by giving them internal/domestic support.

[–] leftAF@hexbear.net 1 points 14 hours ago (1 children)

I think it's easier to not think of nations because what we're trying to identify might be better understood as "neoconservatives", it's a faction of the ruling class that was aligned with the late Sheldon Adelson but his widow continues the legacy seemingly as well as Bibi, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, the Project for a New American Century (PNAC) gang.

We have clear as day examples where Israel decides US troop movement in support of redirecting stolen oil to them during the Iraq War - as happened with CENTCOM's Energy Infrastructure Planning Group deferring to IDF/Mossad agent Michael Makovsky as often as they did, which Gary Vogler has written much about. It's a little bit murkier but Kurds get roped into similar shit too, all the time.

[–] Fingernail2@hexbear.net 1 points 14 hours ago

The neoconservatives control the US via Israel, which can go so far as to dictate troops movements to its exclusive benefit?