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I've seen a lot of posts on this site that are leaning into anti semetic tropes while criticizing Israel. I want to point it out so that folks can recognize it.

First, because I have to say it:

Israel is a colonial outpost of the United States. It was created by Britain and inherited by the US. The US gives Israel ~3,000,000,000 USD in aid every year. As a colony, it should be the goal of every socialist to destroy it, just as we seek the destruction of the US, Northern Ireland, South Korea, Canada, the Phillipine state, etc.

But! Israel is also a safe haven for Jews. This is seperable from the colonial nature of the state. Israel could have been created in Germany or Siberia or frankly Florida for that matter (in fact, annexing Florida to create a new state of Israel is what I mean when i refer to "the one state solution"). In many ways, the US with its civil rights act serves the same purpose, and in fact, most Jews live in the US.

Many of us had ancestors in Germany or Poland during the holocaust who did not stick around after the war. They saw Israel as their best shot at safety in the wake of the holocaust. Many Israelis are liberals, hoping to vote out Likud, stop supporting settlements, and negotiate palestinian statehood. These people are advocating half measures, sure, but they are not our enemies.

So I wanted to point out some anti-semetic tropes I've seen on this website and call them out so you can recognize them.

Conflating Jews in Israel with Zionists.

This can be done through omission. If you aren't clear whether you're talking about jews or a specific institution (for example, the I"D"F or the settlements or Likud), many people will read your statement as being about Jews. Be careful with the word "they"

erasing the ambivalent position of jews within colonialism / conflating jewishness with whiteness

The zionist entity is not a Jewish colonial project, but an Anglo colonial project. It was created by the British and now is funded by the US Americans. Jews are an oppressed minority whose oppression is leveraged against other oppressed peoples. Similarly to how the US uses Kurds to Balkanize Iraq or The Hmong to wage counterinsurgency in Laos, it's uses Jews to destabilize the Levant.

Outside of the US, jews are largely understood as a racial group and oppressed on that basis. Especially in the Arab world where the Islamic hyper nationalism has gained ground in response to colonialism and been funded further by colonialists to their own ends (google "the safari club" or "Israel funds Hamas")

Blood Libel

This one is the assertion that Jews are uniquely bloodthirsty / murder non Jewish children. The classic example of this myth that people are familiar with is Runplestiltskin.

It is true that the IDF under the direction of Likud and the US state is murdering many Gazans, the majority of whom are children. but! be careful to specify. When people talk about "jews" or "israelis" generally as perpetuating the murder of children, they are engaging in the blood libel trope. Again, be careful with the word "they" and specify which entities you're talking about.

calling for ethnic cleansing

Okay, wtf ya'll. It's not jews as an ethnicity that are oppressing Palestinians, it is US imperial power. Jews have always lived in Palestine and the occupation only began in the 40s as part of a British initiative.

Jews will always be part of a palestinian state, and frankly need protections as ethnic and religious minorities. We do not seek the expulsion of Jews from Palestine, but their integration into it as citizens.

Jews are safe in the US not because its a colonial state but because of civil rights protections and generational wealth. If we can create civil rights protections in Palestine and a social safety net (ideally communism but I'll settle for social democracy), then jews will be safe in Palestine.

Jewish control of America / protocols of the elders of zion

America controls Israel and not vice versa. APEC is not a cabal brainwashing otherwise Nobel Christian politicians. US politicians support Israel because they're colonial politicians and Israel is our colony. APEC exists because lobbying is how power is exercised in the US, but if we had patronage instead, APEC' functions would be carried our by a governor or an ambassador or whatever.

conclusion

Recognize the role of the US empire in Palestinian oppression. Recognize that jews are in an ambivalent racial category and are an oppressed people. Be specific when criticizing Israeli colonialism. Name who you're criticizing, is it the settlements? The IDF? Likud? The US military Industrial Complex? Stop calling for ethnic cleansing of jews if you've been doing that. Don't equate jewishness with whiteness / the Nazis. White people are white people, the US is the Nazis.

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[-] frogbellyratbone_@hexbear.net 42 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

APEC is not a cabal brainwashing otherwise Nobel Christian politicians. US politicians support Israel because they're colonial politicians and Israel is our colony. APEC exists because lobbying is how power is exercised in the US, but if we had patronage instead, APEC' functions would be carried our by a governor or an ambassador or whatever.

i'm surprised no one is mentioning the weird "APEC" mention....

friend, with respect, you are struggling to be persuasive on this point. it's AIPAC, not APEC. it's a bummer you don't understand this and leads me to believe you don't really understand how powerful and psychotic AIPAC actually is.

AIPAC is, easily, the most powerful lobby in the USA. It's paired with an Israeli spy/plant network that literally litters the entire government apparatus in the USA. It is the primary reason why America is so betrothed to Israel. All of your points about state planning, ally in the middle east, destabilization, securities corporate interests, etc. all have serious persuasive effect, but we can seriously almost just start and stop at AIPAC to understand the US's relationship with Israel

Great book by Mearsheimer called Israel Lobby and US Foreign Policy written 2008. I imagine it needs to be updated heavily given Citizens United, others. You can probably poke around on YT a bit too I'm sure people have covered the power of AIPAC.

i appreciated this post though. all of the other points you made are good to be reminded about / reinforced to not equate jews/judaism with the psychotic israeli government's foreign policy / us alliance with same.

[-] Vncredleader@hexbear.net 20 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

Israel Lobby is sitting on my shelf. Might be a good time to start it

And yeah AIPAC's influence is not that it brainwashes noble (not nobel that's a last name) Christians, it is that it goes after any dissent and brings it to the attention of said American interests who then crack down on it. No one is saying the victims of AIPAC are the people who attend it, the victims are Palestinians and activists who have their lives ruined by smear campaigns that AIPAC spearheads. Just blatant misunderstanding of how that dynamic works

[-] combat_brandonism@hexbear.net 9 points 8 months ago

It is the primary reason why America is so betrothed to Israel.

Letting American imperialism and white supremacy off the hook here. AIPAC's power is a reflection of it, not the cause.

[-] frogbellyratbone_@hexbear.net 3 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

Letting American imperialism and white supremacy off the hook here.

wasn't my intent. primary =/ the only. as i wrote: state planning, ally in the middle east, destabilization, securities corporate interests, etc. all have serious persuasive effect as well

US has abandoned despots and regimes before that did far, far less than the Israeli government has. Said Barre is the one that most absolutely comes to mind. There's something uniquely special about why the US continues to support Israel despite ongoing atrocities, genocide, and I find AIPAC to be the most persuasive answer (as mentioned, the primary reason, but not the ONLY reason)

[-] combat_brandonism@hexbear.net 1 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

Said Barre

us-foreign-policy

I'm saying you've got your causality reversed. AIPAC has so much power because we give Israel so much money, which they then use to fund lobbies like AIPAC. The only good point in OP (besides the ahistorical origin narrative) is that Israel is effectively an American settler-colony. Viewing its agents, particularly those within US borders, as distinct from the US itself is ignoring the material reality and buying into their artificial distinction. I.e. they don't have to register as foreign agents, etc. etc. They are effectively indistinguishable from the rest of the state department.

Also recommending Mearsheimer here when there's an absolute wealth of ML or adjacent writing and other media available is like recommending something Kissinger wrote on China. You don't, in fact, have to hand it to em.

[-] frogbellyratbone_@hexbear.net 2 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

when there's an absolute wealth of ML or adjacent writing and other media available is like recommending something Kissinger wrote on China

examples? ...why be condescending and write there's so much available sources but then list none?

as far as causation, chicken/egg. yes, AIPAC wasn't around during the nakba. the situation has evolved since then. i just don't find it super persuasive that if AIPAC went away overnight that the usa would continue to support israeli foreign policy / apartheid

[-] combat_brandonism@hexbear.net 3 points 8 months ago* (last edited 8 months ago)

Worth noting alongside a critique of Mearsheimer that Haymarket is disturbingly close to State Department-approved talking points on too many designated foreign enemies for a publisher that positions themselves as 'leftist', but Palestine's a rare exception. Chomsky-esque that way.

The difference is that a Mearsheimer critique of the Israel Lobby is like one degree removed from some deranged fascist linking to the protocols or the turner diaries or something. As you can see by the current banner on his website highlighting his interview with some reason magazine (and ex-Fox News iirc?) libertarian-approaching:

[-] newerAccountWhoDis@hexbear.net 9 points 8 months ago

> Recommending YT for researching antisemitism

ursus-hexagonia

otherwise interesting post

this post was submitted on 17 Oct 2023
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