Didn't really expect much from DrivingUk but honestly the amount of downvotes shocked me. God forbid people go out at night dressed normally without full on high vis.
Reddit Link: https://www.reddit.com/r/drivingUK/comments/1r8fkfo/comment/o65j18p/
this post was submitted on 19 Feb 2026
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I’m going to go against the groupthink here.
If I’m driving at night I sometimes come across people wearing specifically dark clothing walking in the street or crossing in poorly illuminated areas, seemly unaware of the cars.
I too, wish we lived in a less car centric society, and I know if I hit them it’s my fault. But wearing all black and walking in poorly illuminated streets unaware of traffic is profoundly stupid.
Im not saying they have to don hi-vis, but the all back is certainly a choice.
I agree with you 100%. As a motorcycle rider and pedestrian/runner, I am all too aware that even if you are in the right as to your personal choices - it will suuuuuck to be unseen from someone piloting a larger vehicle. Responsibility doesn't solely fall on the pedestrian in this instance - but why wouldn't someone at a disadvantage want to up their visibility? Had a bicyclist the other night on an unlit Street wearing all black and no lights or reflectors on their bicycle. 25mph zone but two way narrow in-town street. I only knew they was there because the car in front of me crossed the double yellow - and looking in the rear view, had pulled off to the side but was next to invisible...
might as well vantablack.
Part of the problem is many winter coats and a pair of jeans will look all black at night. Couple that with high speeds, poor lighting, and parked cars blocking sightlines and the problem gets hard to blame one specific factor. IMO its mostly a roadway design problem but it is an unfortunate reality that you have be very alert at night and assume every car cannot see you.
Certainly I don’t think the onus is on the pedestrian to solve to overall problem, which exists because of the things you point out. I’m only saying the pedestrian is responsible for their own safety.
If I am responsible for my safety I should be allowed to carry a brick at all times.
As far as I understand, you are definitely allowed to carry a brick.
You are allowed to do that.
If we've learned anything from ICE, it's that a vehicle is a deadly weapon, and shooting a driver in the face is sometimes justified.
/s
A line I've used before is "It won't be your fault, but it will be your problem."
Pedestrians should be able to walk on the roads. It should be down to cars to not hit them. However, when they screw up. The car owner has a dented car, you have shatter bones and organs.
It's against the grain here, but my personal view is that all school kits should be given a family size pack of high Vis strap vests and taught the risks. It's amazing how effective an educated 8 year old can be at changing behaviours.
My 6 year old big sister convinced my mother that my father lighting up in the house on the way outside to smoke was not okay and then convinced my father that smoking was bad enough to quit, even if it really was only every one or two pipes a week
I grew up in the far north, winters were very long and very dark. Every kids jacket had prominent reflective materials.
I still look for that when I get a winter jacket.
The OP on Reddit literally admits they didn't look at the crossing in their post lol and this is what we're focusing on? In the fuck cars community? Watch the video. There's no way that would have played out any differently even in broad daylight. And no amount of vigilance would have helped that pedestrian.
Being dark isn't a choice. People, dogs, cats, birds, etc are born that way.
Even clothing sometimes isn't a choice. It's pretty common in work attire to require black shoes and slacks. Formal attire also leans dark.
Formal wear doesn’t include helmets, yet we still expect people to put on a helmet if they get on a bike.
We are talking about walking, its the default method of moving. You are suggesting people need safety gear to be able to walk down the street. The police can give you a ticket for not wearing your safety walking gear? Is walking on the street a privellage not a right?
Don't worry, they will privatize the roads after elections are fixed, and they will make walking a crime.
We shouldn't though. The responsibility should fall on those who create the danger to manage it responsibly.
I do wear a helmet but if someone chooses not to that's their business and it's not their fault if someone else injures or kills them any more than it would be if you failed to wear body armor while walking in a dangerous neighborhood.
I wear a helmet while biking. It's saved me from a head injury once so far, in an accident that had nothing to do with being hit by a car.
I don't think it should be legally required, though, because avoiding discouraging people from cycling at all is more important for safety and health in aggregate.
(I was riding along at relatively low speed, looking up at some scenery, and hit the longitudinal edge of a cockeyed metal plate in the road in just the wrong way such that it pushed my wheel sideways and made me fall over.)
Yeah I support helmet wearing. I just don't think we should blame people for bad things that other people do to them just because they chose not to.
Comes down to if you want to assign blame or prevent it from happening to you.
Yes, if you’re riding without a helmet and hit by a car, the car is (probably) still at fault. But if your primary concern is avoiding brain damage, you wear a helmet.
You’ve chosen hyperbole in your hypothetical in a dangerous neighborhood. More to the point is wearing an expensive watch while in a dangerous neighborhood. If you’re rolled and the watch stolen, it’s the fault of the thief. But maybe a better idea to put the Rolex in your pocket when downtown after dark.
I think my analogy is way more similar than yours.
Make your own decisions about how you keep yourself safe. But once you start victim blaming, expect criticism.
Nope. We’re talking basic common sense precautions. Not “body armor.”
"Common sense" stems from the cultural context. Which in this case is carbrain.
Most other countries do not consider a helmet a necessity for riding a bike.
I ride exclusively on bike trails, away from any cars. Other countries are wrong on this one.
How wonderful for you that you have the privilege of doing so. Most of us don't.
I’m not going to edit my comment, but I shouldn’t have said exclusivity. I should have said that most of my mileage is ridden away from cars, and thus wearing a helmet isn’t due to proximity to cars. I wear a helmet when I’m riding in car traffic as well, but not because of the cars.
Riding a bike anywhere without a helmet is disregarding your safety. I’m not saying it needs to be legislated, but don’t pretend you’re enlightened because you rawdog your bike.
It's all about risk tolerance. Wearing a helmet on a bike keeps you a little safer. Wearing body armor keeps you a little safer. Those are facts. But the decision as to what actions to take to keep oneself safe is a personal decision. As such, it may be reasonable to advise people of that information so they can make a better decision. But insulting them for failing to take advice you personally consider common sense is just rude. And when you're insulting them and ignoring the person actually creating the danger... well that's why the term carbrain was invented.
I support people who choose not to wear a helmet; they’ve obviously already experienced brain damage.
Most places with functional, safe bike lanes will have most people riding without helmets because accidents are quite rare.
Riding a bike without a helmet is profoundly stupid.
Go on, oneguy the entire Netherlands.
As is driving a car without a helmet, given the number of head injuries that result. But here we are.
I'm sure you meant seatbelt. In which case I agree wholeheartedly.
Seatbelts are good, too, but they don't protect the head, and head injuries from mild to severe are still quite common. It's utter stupidity not to wear a helmet in the car.
Look up the car-crash head injury rates yourself.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safety_reflector
Even if safety reflectors become widely adopted- let's suppose that workers leaving the office at 5pm put one on, clubbers at midnight have them, whatever - then won't motorists come to expect to see them? And if they hit someone, people might say, "Well, she wasn't wearing safety reflectors - what do you expect?"
When I go running around my neighborhood at night I actually do wear hi-vis, I don't even run on the street. People just suck at paying attention in general.
Well shit I guess I need to go get a fuschia tracksuit for my night walks. A whole different set of drivers can harass me for a new reason.
IMO it's fine to wear dark, but be aware that drivers will have a harder time seeing you and you should be careful crossing the street.
Just don't cross a road without looking and you should be good.
Fuck off. Email or call your city council member and advocate for better pedestrian infrastructure. Do it, right now.
I live in the Netherlands. We have excellent pedestrian infrastructure, I can safely walk anywhere.
We also raise our kids explaining them to always look both ways, to never suddenly cross the road and never to assume a driver has actually seen you. It's basic road safety, you so the same for crossing a bicycle path or railroad tracks.
It's an insult to tell someone to look before crossing the street in a fuckcars comm. Like no shit. Why do you think we're all in here. It's really frustrating because accounting for the externalities of cars is the normative state of being for us, nobody is in here to fool themselves about that fact, we're here because of it. At least I am. I'm not really down in this thread to entertain the myth of the bumbling jay as some sage counter-argument. It's not.
Both can be true.
It can (and is) true that we need better pedestrian infrastructure. Or more to the point, less car-centric infrastructure.
But it can (and is) also true that a pedestrian should take basic safety precautions when around dangerous things. He should likewise look both ways before crossing a bike path (infrastructure we support) and shouldn't cross train tracks (also infrastructure we support) when the train is coming.
We live largely in a world that caters to cars. I hope that can change. But that doesn't absolve personal safety responsibility.
Sorry safety interferes with your fashion choices.
I suppose sarcasm isn't a great way to get through to someone who's tone deaf.
But sure you really gave all of us black-on-black serial midnight car dodgers something to chew on, we had never thought about how visibility affects our safety ever before. First time!