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I have used Arch for >13 years (btw) and use the terminal every single session. I also work with Linux servers daily, so I tried the other families with DEs (Debian/Ubuntu, RHEL/CentOS/AlmaLinux/Fedora).

I'm comfortable (and prefer) doing everything with CLI tools. For me, it's a bit difficult to convert my Windows friends, as they all see me as some kind of hackerman.

What's the landscape like nowadays, in terms of terminal requirements?

Bonus question: Which distribution is the most user-friendly while still updated packages? Does anything provide a similar experience to Arch's amazing AUR?

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[–] ZkhqrD5o@lemmy.world 1 points 16 minutes ago
[–] ian@feddit.uk 2 points 47 minutes ago

Yes it is possible. I never need the terminal. If you are interested, you can usually find a GUI way if you look for one. Some people just don't look, then tell people there is no GUI for it. Not very helpful for newbies.

For those not into usability, different people work in different ways. Visual workers are not the same as text workers. So for some, CLI has poor usability and productivity. For lots of things I do, there isn't a CLI anyway.

I use Kubuntu these days. It could be better.

[–] BlackCat@piefed.social 1 points 54 minutes ago

I almost asked this exact question today. I installed Ubuntu (Studio) for the first time and almost immediately needed to do some CLI shit because there's no GUI option to enable jumbo frames. I don't want to learn CLI. I just want to escape Windows.

[–] undrwater@lemmy.world 2 points 1 hour ago (1 children)

All modern OS's require the terminal at some point.

To your bonus question: portage

[–] schnurrito@discuss.tchncs.de 1 points 1 hour ago

I've never used the terminal on Android for anything serious. I've used it, but only for really nerdy things most users will never need.

[–] harfang@slrpnk.net 0 points 48 minutes ago
[–] luluberlue@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

"User-friendly" and "updated" sadly sounds incompatible. In just slightly less than one year of using Fedora I've had 3 bad qt updates that broke kde's softwares like kmail, 2 bad amd-gpu updates that made the gpu crash and 1 pipewire update that broke surround sound.

Those were all minor updates that were easy to revert though, just had to use the terminal for that and wait the next fixed version.

[–] Ricaz@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 36 minutes ago

You make it sound like Fedora is a lot less stable than Arch. I've had one update go wrong in 10 years lol

[–] Archr@lemmy.world 6 points 6 hours ago (3 children)

If you are just doing word processing, browsing the web, and playing video games then absolutely. Yes.

There have been gui tools available to install packages, configure networking/wifi, and manipulate files. For a long time now. Especially with the integration of Flatpak and snaps into gui-based package managers (like pop shop) it has become quite simple for any "regular", non-technical user to manage the basics and even the intermediates of any system (depending on the distro).

Where things will likely fall short is with troubleshooting. But to solve that we would need to build something like the windows troubleshooter. But with so applications owned by so many different groups it would be difficult/near impossible to write a troubleshooter to integrate them together.

Though I am also a bit of a hackerman so I probably also don't realize how much I use the terminal for normal things.

[–] DornerStan@lemmygrad.ml 1 points 1 hour ago

Tbh I can't remember the last time windows troubleshooter actually solved a single problem when trying to help people with their PCs. And there's like a fraction of a percent of the amount of discussion and documentation online for Windows versus Linux. A lot of problems for the former are literally just unsolvable.

[–] baconsunday@lemmy.zip 1 points 4 hours ago (1 children)

Any you recommend for gaming? Ive had an issue getting steam games to launch, and I have heard cod will be a no-go, but that's not a big deal to me.

I play emulators mostly because I miss when buying stuff meant owning it.

[–] Archr@lemmy.world 1 points 3 hours ago

Without knowing what game you were having issues with I can't provide much help. I would first recommend checking https://protondb.com/ to see the games status and if other people are running into issues. Most of the fixes are as simple as just switching what proton version you are using. (if someone recommends using a GloriousEggroll (GE) version of Proton then look into the app proton-up-qt, on your software center).

But I will admit many solutions on protondb are much more "involved".

As far as non-steam suggestions. I would start with heroic games launcher. I have had a very easy time with playing games through HGL, either EpicGames or GoG.

Outside of that, lutris is good. If you go to their website then there are one click installs for a bunch of games. This is mostly how I play things like battle.net games.

Then on the technical side of things is bottles. But that is the much more "build it yourself" option.

[–] Archr@lemmy.world 1 points 6 hours ago

Even debian will let you download a Deb, double-click it in the file browser, and install it.

[–] khanh@lemmy.zip 0 points 3 hours ago

Definetely yes for years now. However, CLI is still preferred.

[–] Tenderizer78@lemmy.ml 2 points 6 hours ago

Generally you can use use the GUI with things like Nobara Linux.

But most software install instructions are all "copy and paste these commands".

[–] Geodes_n_Gems@lemmy.ml 3 points 7 hours ago

As a Linux Mint user who has only used Linux Mint, Yes, I've hardly used the Terminal, I've really only used it to download & run specific Software which is really just optional most of the time.

[–] Stopwatch1986@lemmy.ml 3 points 8 hours ago (1 children)

Windows refugee here. I installed Debian 13 with KDE Plasma on my main machine four months ago and I am still ironing out issues. Eg CUPS was asking me to login all the time and didn't accept my credentials. After some days researching I discovered I had to log in as root. Then, I discovered I didn't have root credentials for some reason. I had to create them and then add my local user to a group! Just to be able to use my home printer.

Or suddenly my clock was 62 minutes off. I discovered the NTP service was never set up properly and I had to install chrony.

I don't see how I could have avoided using the terminal. These are only a couple of examples. No deal-breakers and on this occasion I had the time and determination to resolve them. I could have easily given up.

[–] ozymandias117@lemmy.world 2 points 7 hours ago

Just a heads up, you should just need the group set up

That is crazy that you weren't added to it by default, though.

I was also surprised - you used to be able to modify a user's group membership through the System Settings GUI. That's a huge missing piece that you can't do that anymore

[–] i_am_somebody@lemmy.sdf.org 4 points 12 hours ago

I installed Linux for my mother 15 years ago and she has never used the terminal once.

I update the Ubuntu from time to time and that’s it. Everything works and she can browse the internet, read email and listen to music.

[–] FauxLiving@lemmy.world 6 points 13 hours ago

Just as much as you can use Windows without the command line/powershell.

The vast majority of tasks do not require it but some will and some tasks will be easier via the terminal if you take the time to read 2-3 pages of documentation.

Don't be scared of the terminal

[–] Adderbox76@lemmy.ca 7 points 14 hours ago

Yes.

After god knows how many years now of being on Linux exclusively, I tend to look at the terminal (commands in general) as a convenience more than a necessity. Meaning that in a lot of cases, knowing a command and quickly typing it to start an update (for example) is just faster and easier than pulling up the GUI every time.

[–] Core_of_Arden@lemmy.ml 3 points 12 hours ago (1 children)

I don't know why you would want to use linux without the terminal? I mean, you can... but you'll be limited if you want to do something special or fix a problem. It's not like you have to know how to code or anything. Often you can copy the commands right into it... It's really no problem.

[–] Ricaz@lemmy.dbzer0.com 6 points 12 hours ago (4 children)

People who have been using Windows their entire lives simply get intimidated

[–] luluberlue@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 3 hours ago (1 children)

As someone in this category : wtf? I kept using the terminal all the time when I was still on windows. From 95's dos to 11's cmd.

[–] Ricaz@lemmy.dbzer0.com 1 points 32 minutes ago

Sure, but then you're definitely not an average Windows user. I'm trying to get normal people off it

[–] Codilingus@sh.itjust.works 1 points 11 hours ago

Can confirm, I helped a friend put Fedora on their old laptop to give it life again. Even though I wrote them instructions, once it came time for the terminal stuff, they video called me, lol. They love using that laptop now, though! They were in their early 20s for reference.

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[–] WereCat@lemmy.world 37 points 20 hours ago

Can I? Yes. Will I? No.

Some things are just faster to do via terminal so I learned to use it over GUI for some scenarios.

[–] eugenia@lemmy.ml 10 points 16 hours ago (1 children)

With Linux Mint you don't need the terminal 99% of the time. The rest distros are close to 95% of the time. I always suggest Mint to new users.

[–] flameleaf@lemmy.ml 2 points 14 hours ago

Last time I set up Mint the only thing I needed the terminal for was to disable a setting on Java 8 that prevented it from launching on Xfce.

I didn't need to use the terminal to do that, though. It just didn't feel right editing a system config file with a GUI text editor.

[–] pastermil@sh.itjust.works 15 points 17 hours ago (1 children)

I cannot vouch for every distro and every use case out there, but for me, yes you can daily drive without having anything to do with terminal. Some distros have worked a lot ensuring this.

I would recommend to start with Linux Mint.

[–] ardorhb@discuss.tchncs.de 2 points 15 hours ago

I agree. In my opinion Mint is one of the few distros that actually manage to make everything doable without the terminal.

[–] bjoern_tantau@swg-empire.de 33 points 21 hours ago

SUSE has had graphical administration tools for literally decades. Somehow people always forget that.

[–] utopiah@lemmy.ml 6 points 15 hours ago

turns off SteamDeck sorry, what's a "terminal"? Isn't it at the airport?

Jokes aside... yes, obviously, it only depends what you actually need to do. I recommend though NOT to be afraid of the terminal. The whole point about using Linux is to do whatever one wants. If that means avoiding the terminal, sure, that's fine, BUT I believe the goal still is to be able to do MORE and the terminal is itself a very powerful tool. It's not the terminal itself as much as the composability of the CLI.

So... finding a distribution with all the GUI and TUI and avoiding the CLI until they actually want to use them is great. Avoiding it entirely because no new skill was acquired is a missed opportunity IMHO. I want more Linux users, yes, but I also want BETTER users of any OS. Skilling up users so that we can all do more, together.

[–] Auster@thebrainbin.org 22 points 21 hours ago (2 children)

Using Linux Mint, most of what I use I could without terminals if I wish. However, just like with Windows, terminal intervention will be needed sooner or later, usually to figure out why a given program isn't working.

[–] AmbitiousProcess@piefed.social 11 points 20 hours ago (1 children)

Exactly. You can get away without using the terminal on a lot of linux distros in the same way you can get away without using CMD on Windows... until one very specific thing breaks and suddenly it's time to run sfc /scannow for the millionth time.

[–] Attacker94@lemmy.world 1 points 11 hours ago

I personally don't understand why that command doesn't run every time the system starts up by default, I wrote a script that ran it on startup years ago and I can't tell you how many times it tells me that there were files that needed repairing.

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[–] Mycatiskai@lemmy.ca 1 points 10 hours ago

I was using Mint for a while with my 10 year old PC build that was crashing all the time then I upgraded my system and Mint didn't have support for my newer video card so I moved to Nobara.

I haven't had to use the terminal at all since. I run the update system program every few days but I'm sure it could be automated without needing a password but I like seeing what is being updated so I keep it manual.

It has much more support for games than Mint seems to have had. I could use the terminal if I wanted to but it hasn't been needed which is how I want it, available but unnecessary.

[–] cypherpunks@lemmy.ml 1 points 11 hours ago* (last edited 11 hours ago)

Does anything provide a similar experience to Arch’s amazing AUR

I am not aware of any software distribution service with a comparable experience (massive userbase with zero vetting for uploaders) as Arch's amazing AUR - if you are looking for a way to distribute malware to many unsuspecting people (who's friends think they're hackerman), it's really unparalleled. (😢)

To your primary question, yes, many people do successfully daily drive various Linux distros without ever opening the terminal. 🙄

[–] orenj@lemmy.sdf.org 2 points 13 hours ago

Ive only used the terminal on my laptop for installing programs i could've installed from a gui, and for updating. Which i could've done on a gui.

So i think so? Manjaro btw

[–] frondo@lemmy.ml 6 points 17 hours ago* (last edited 17 hours ago)

I would stay that for 95% of usual tasks I don't use terminal on Linux Mint Debian Faye 6 (LMDE), most of the software can be installed by double clicking a .deb file you download from the web. Compared to 10 years ago when I tried Linux for the first time (and reverted to Win back then) nowadys it is insanely more convenient to use.

[–] DieserTypMatthias@lemmy.ml 1 points 11 hours ago

As a Rust dev, you can use your terminal entirely without GUI with a multiplexer like tmux, Neovim as your editor, a shit ton of anime CLIs that you can use, and so on.

Bonus question: [...] Does anything provide a similar experience to Arch's amazing AUR?

Nixpkgs and Homebrew are the first ones that come from my head.

[–] Crashumbc@lemmy.world 8 points 18 hours ago (7 children)

Unless you install fresh, run into NO issues. And basically do nothing but websurf, and basic functions, not likely.

Keep in mind, even IF something could be done by GUI, if you ask for help, 95% of the replies are immediately going to tell you to open CLI...

Remember Linux isn't an OS, it is a collection of 30+ different OSs that are mostly compatible.

[–] atzanteol@sh.itjust.works 10 points 17 hours ago

basically do nothing but websurf, and basic functions

That's 99% of what most people do.

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[–] Mihies@programming.dev 14 points 21 hours ago

Depends on what they are doing, but I guess it's pretty usable without cli interventions - at least for standard apps and unless something gets screwed. Fedora KDE.

[–] a14o@feddit.org 8 points 19 hours ago

I think Gnome + Flatpak is a great setup for GUI only. Fedora is annoying to set up with nonfree drivers and codecs, otherwise it's a great choice for this.

(Also, don't try convert your friends, just wait until they come to you and ask for help installing Linux.)

[–] VerseAndVermin@lemmy.world 1 points 12 hours ago

I've been using exclusively Linux for about two years now.

I only ever use the terminal when I need to fix something, usually by searching for a fix and trying it out. I know more about its use now but just enough to hurt myself.

I think it gives me strong UI opinions though. What works better for me. There is still a lot of choice in that.

[–] umbrella@lemmy.ml 1 points 13 hours ago

i use the terminal for work, and some utilities i prefer over gui ones.

if my line of work didn't require it, i don't think it would be mandatory for me.

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