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submitted 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago) by sith@lemmy.zip to c/fediverse@lemmy.world

It is clear that the signal to noise ratio of the WWW is getting worse. It's much harder to find good content when using a good old search engine. And if it's good it is usually hosted on Reddit or Stackexchange.

So remember, even if it's easy too Google something (well, it isn't nowadays), we want to create a fediverse of good content that helps people (I hope). So, it's always better to write a real answer if you have the time and energy. Please help boost the SNR and reverse the AI fueled information degradation loop.

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[-] hono4kami@slrpnk.net 220 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

As a software engineer...

Don't just say "just Google it". Guide them to the documentation. Ask them about the detail of the question. If it's an bug, try asking them if they can reproduce the bug.


This reminded me of the time I'm looking for how to do certain things in a software. I found a reddit post asking about the same issue and this is the reply OP got:

screenshot of a reddit thread where OP got a rude reply to search it themselves

Here is the link: https://old.reddit.com/r/i3wm/comments/mupjsf/how_to_showhide_i3status_bar_taskbar/

Imagine. You search the issue you have. Found the ONLY reddit thread that talks about this, and the ONLY thread that talks about the issue have NO USEFUL ANSWER and, worse, the only reply is TELLING YOU TO SEARCH IT YOURSELF. This got upvoted too 😭😭😭.

Luckily, I found the solution (tbh the solution was there in the docs, but the wording wasn't clear and it makes it hard to search) and I end up replying the OP the actual answer.

So, this is a PSA for the fediverse: be nice. It's free.

While we're still young, we have a chance to become a better forum.

Also possibly an unpopular opinion: you shouldn't downvote a question, even if it was asked multiple times. Guide them to the answer instead

[-] TimewornTraveler@lemm.ee 45 points 4 days ago

Wow that is infuriating.

[-] otacon239@lemmy.world 38 points 4 days ago
[-] CrayonRosary@lemmy.world 31 points 4 days ago

Even worse is when they edit their post to add "Never mind, figured it out."

[-] wreckedcarzz@lemmy.world 16 points 4 days ago

These people should be unable to reproduce. Just as soon as they edit the post, a shriek of agony can be heard for miles.

I ran across an example of this recently, on fucking Github. Bitch it's your goddamn issue ticket, on a fucking dev site, and you returned to say you figured it out but can't be fucked to explain how? GAHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

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[-] jagged_circle@feddit.nl 14 points 4 days ago

Also Google results differ since like a decade. It may show for you in California, but its nowhere to be found for me in Iran

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[-] Zementid@feddit.nl 26 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago)

I feel like it’s 2000 all over again on the Internet. The bloat has made pages borderline unusable, and using AdBlock or NoScript reverts any so-called "design progress" back to the good old HTML days.

Google is only semi-useful now, while pages like DuckDuckGo are starting to deliver results reminiscent of the old Yahoo or Lycos days.

It feels like my trusty, old-school Internet skills are helping me navigate this mess. The reemergence of usenet / groups feels inevitable.

[-] sheogorath@lemmy.world 4 points 3 days ago

It's like a bouncing ball, social media starts small, and then it became bigger. It's trending on becoming small again. In the future (barring civilization ending war/calamity) it'll become big again due to some technological progress or shift in society.

[-] richieadler@lemmy.myserv.one 16 points 3 days ago

If you don't show me that you at least made some effort to investigate: No.

[-] Merlin@discuss.tchncs.de 4 points 3 days ago

Its a bit annoying when i google something and search forums and cant find an answer and i go to ask reddit or a forum and someone says"just google it" like am i really expected to make a preamble every ask-post that I've searched already?

[-] richieadler@lemmy.myserv.one 5 points 2 days ago

i really expected to make a preamble every ask-post that I’ve searched already?

Yes. You need to show your effort, otherwise your question will be considered lazy. This is specially true regarding technical issues in volunteer forums.

The seminal essay "How To Ask Questions the Smart Way" explains these and other finer points.

[-] jg1i@lemmy.world 124 points 4 days ago

Not sure if everyone knows this, but: if you don't want to answer the question—you don't have to post a reply! Crazy idea, I know.

[-] affiliate@lemmy.world 12 points 4 days ago

what if i want to answer the question but i have none of the relevant knowledge and also don’t really understand the question itself?

[-] WhiskyTangoFoxtrot@lemmy.world 11 points 4 days ago

Just Google it.

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[-] Ookami38@sh.itjust.works 65 points 4 days ago

"just Google it" has always been a shitty reply. People are asking for your opinion because they want opinions from people, not some nameless site/author/whatever. Even if you're just regurgitating information, it's coming from a PERSON not a random article. Never mind the reliability of the source. Heavens forbid that we social creatures social about a thing for a bit.

"I'm not responsible for educating you"

cool, then stfu and let somebody else or nut up and do the work if you want it done right

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[-] FiskFisk33@startrek.website 90 points 4 days ago

So many times I google something obscure, the top result is the same question asked on some forum with a single reply, "just google it"

[-] pezhore@infosec.pub 54 points 4 days ago

The only thing worse than someone saying just Google it is an op replying to their own post saying, never mind fixed it! (Without actually saying the solution).

[-] ech@lemm.ee 31 points 4 days ago

"What did you see, DenverCoder9?!?!"

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[-] Snowpix@lemmy.ca 18 points 4 days ago

and worse, it's a thread from 17 years ago and apparently nobody else except you has had the issue since.

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[-] brygphilomena@lemmy.world 41 points 4 days ago

I'm starting to give up on Google. I've literally copy and pasted the same error message in Google, DuckDuckGo, and Kagl.

Google will respond with "no results found" while the others will actually give me a response.

okay so it's not just me then! I've been seeing that zero matches page more and more. It used to be the other way around, if I couldnt find something on DDG or startpage it would be on google. how did they fuck up their indexing so badly

[-] Rogue@feddit.uk 21 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago)

I think zero matches means "we weren't able to find any suitable ads so we don't give a fuck about you"

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[-] Cethin@lemmy.zip 12 points 3 days ago

Yeah, I ditched Google as my default search engine a while ago. It's next to useless and they're a horrible company.

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[-] rickyrigatoni@lemm.ee 53 points 4 days ago

The amount of times I've googled a problem, and the first result is a forum post of someone just being told to google it then locking the thread is way too high.

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[-] Clent@lemmy.world 35 points 3 days ago
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"Google It"

I google

finds 1 link

its a link to a fourm post with the same question

only 1 answer found

answer says "Google It"

🙃

[-] DarkThoughts@fedia.io 34 points 4 days ago

Old Reddit threads where the answer giver deleted their account & all their comments.

[-] hono4kami@slrpnk.net 39 points 4 days ago

That's why when I left reddit I don't delete my posts (even if those posts suck)

Bonus:

a screenshot of deleted reddit comment with a reply thanking the parent commenter

[-] ubergeek@lemmy.today 21 points 4 days ago

I did, bc reddit locked up my content, and wanted to use it to train a LLM.

Let people ask again, here, in the fediverse.

[-] hono4kami@slrpnk.net 18 points 4 days ago

(already had a feeling that someone will say this)

I won't delete my posts/comments because I want to be helpful, that's it.

But if I prefer deleting my posts/comments, I will archive it instead.

I respect what r/ArtFundamentals did, and it should be an example: After reddit's APIpocalypse, they don't support reddit and decided to close the subreddit. But the advices from the subreddit wasn't gone--in fact they actually archive it in their own website:

https://drawabox.com/r/artfundamentals/

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[-] MITM0@lemmy.world 21 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago)

Noooooo don't Just Google it try, Use a Search Engine or just WebSearch it

Dont't make Google an integral part of internet culture

[-] udon@lemmy.world 4 points 3 days ago

I wish I had the power to make google a not integral part of the internet just by calling it duckduckgoing.

On that note: If you talk about what you searched for last week, would that be "I duckduckgoed" or "I duckduckwent"?

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[-] CubitOom@infosec.pub 40 points 4 days ago

Also, fuck Google. I've been removing the word from my lexicon. I say, let me search (or research) that instead

[-] brucethemoose@lemmy.world 31 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

“Check the documentation” should absolutely be a retort though.

One of my least favorite things about the fediverse (and especially Discord and Reddit) is members asking the same simple question hundreds of times because they didn’t bother to do a simple search and didn’t bother to check obvious documentation.

They didn’t know the documentation exists? OK, I will happily show you, and show you how to find it in general. Question only partially novel? Great, I will link an old answer and explain the rest… But I am kinda fed up with how “ephemeral” social media is, which is by design, as that repetitiveness increases engagement dramatically. Many forums should be structured more like a wiki, and its users should reflect that.

[-] sith@lemmy.zip 24 points 4 days ago

That kind of behavior can also be a sign that the documentation is hard to find or hard to comprehend. Or that something isn't documented at all, but the seniors imagine it is, because the answer is obvious to them.

[-] Lost_My_Mind@lemmy.world 12 points 4 days ago

Me. This is me. I'm trying to figure out linux.

"How do I do.....something"

"Oh, that's easy! Just do this and this and this. Make sure you check that that and that."

"Ok.......now how do I do the things you just said?"

"Just do those things the right way."

"I DON'T EVEN KNOW WHAT THOSE TERMS MEAN, LET ALONE HOW TO DO THEM!!!"

"Ugh, this guy can't even follow simple directions. What part of that do you not understand???"

"Uhhhhhh......core concepts?"

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[-] Draegur@lemm.ee 19 points 4 days ago

When I ask someone for clarification via their expertise, I usually reflexively indicate that I cannot trust google because of the incursion of AI slop, and even if it shows THEM accurate results, it is no guarantee that it will show ME those same results.

[-] Sunshine@lemmy.ca 4 points 3 days ago

Check on Ecosia!

[-] Mikina@programming.dev 22 points 4 days ago

I've never had issues with looking anything up. By downranking Reddit and using a search engine with a good indexer that downranks bullshit and generated websites, which mine is really good at, I haven't noticed much change from how it was before.

But I agree with the second part. That's something that never occured to me, and it makes sense. I was usually trying to answer questions I knew, and never had the urge to reply "just google it", so it doesn't change much for me, but it's a really good point I never realized.

[-] sith@lemmy.zip 38 points 4 days ago

Remember that most people don't even know there is something called "rankings" or "indexer" in this context.

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[-] Gradually_Adjusting@lemmy.world 20 points 4 days ago

Search engines are mega sucky these days, but Wikipedia has never been better. I find myself going straight to wiki any time I need a quick fact or basic info.

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[-] Churbleyimyam@lemm.ee 18 points 4 days ago

The most useful thing about interacting with another human mind is that it can see when the question needs to be updated in order to get a correct answer.

A crude example would be:

Q1: how many screws should I use to join these pieces of wood?

A1: It's more relevant to use screws which are long enough.

Q2: Which screws should I use?

A2: This size.

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this post was submitted on 14 Dec 2024
772 points (94.1% liked)

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