Shouldn't have said anything, now I'm getting paragraphs upon paragraphs about Putler and how the West has a moral obligation to prolong the war in Ukraine for as long as possible sad-boi

Also while apparently it can't be denied that the far right has grown somewhat stronger in Ukraine, the Ukrainian military had to rely on militias such as Azov so they wouldn't lose, we should not worry because they haven't seen that much electoral success

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[–] Gosplan14_the_Third@hexbear.net 12 points 1 year ago (6 children)

I love how nobody considers any alternatives to supporting one of the sides in the war - either supporting Ukraine because something something democracy, human rights and Putler or support Russia because multipolarity, denazification and NATO expansion.

I only know of one such initiative - the split of the group "Communist Organisation" from Germany which aligned with the Greek Communist Party created a campaign to give financial support for various communist groups in Ukraine and Russia they had contacts with. It was cautious and didn't really go anywhere.

But at least it existed. Why support either side beyond acting like a foreign minister in the 1970s? Where's the proletarian internationalism?

It'd be more productive than the dead end we're in, at the mercy of whatever which state does or doesn't.

[–] thetaT@hexbear.net 8 points 1 year ago (4 children)

Remember - Lenin never supported any side in WW1. In fact, he hoped for an enemy victory, as that would create the conditions for a revolution.

Picking sides in an inter-imperialist war is anti-Lenin.

[–] Kaplya@hexbear.net 33 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

From Lenin’s Lecture on “The Proletariat and the War” (1914)

For a Marxist clarifying the nature of the war is a necessary preliminary for deciding the question of his attitude to it. But for such a clarification it is essential, first and foremost, to establish the objective conditions and concrete circumstances of the war in question. It is necessary to consider the war in the historical environment in which it is taking place, only then can one determine one’s attitude to it. Otherwise, the resulting interpretation will be not materialist but eclectic.

Depending on the historical circumstances, the relationship of classes, etc., the attitude to war must be different at different times. It is absurd once and for all to renounce participation in war in principle. On the other hand, it is also absurd to divide wars into defensive and aggressive. In 1848, Marx hated Russia, because at that time democracy in Germany could not win out and develop, or unite the country into a single national whole, so long as the reactionary hand of backward Russia hung heavy over her.

In order to clarify one’s attitude to the present war, one must understand how it differs from previous wars, and what its peculiar features are.

The war in Ukraine is not WWI.

[–] highalectical@lemmygrad.ml 4 points 1 year ago

/thread

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