this post was submitted on 03 Jul 2023
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You are making the extraordinary claim, that despite socialism being used throughout the world, it simply doesn't work. Therefore the onus of proof is on you. So, can you please describe why socialism doesn't work?
Where. Give me an example of a socialist country
China, Cuba, Vietnam, and Laos are all examples of socialist countries today. China alone lifted over 800 million people out of poverty in recent decades. Compare that to the capitalist paradise in India.
China is a terrible example of a socialist economy, and the others are still mired by poverty. One could claim that is due to capitalist sabotage, but I don't think it does socialism any favors to use them as success stories.
China is in fact an excellent example of a socialist country. Here's a detailed explanation for you that's well sourced and referenced https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BT7Th2aV0wM
I'm going to level with you, I don't have time to watch an hour long video for a topic that is likely just government-approved talking points.
In practice, I just don't see any difference in the way the mega rich in China control society, just as they do in the rest of the western world. There is too much aesthetic reverence for the West in the upper eschelons of Chinese society.
It is just as dystopic as the West with the way workers are used as fodder by megacorps with no regard for their well-being. Any country with such widespread income inequality cannot call itself a socialist success story.
You used a lot of words to say that you don't actually know anything about China and are unwilling to educate yourself. I guess just keep on believing your chauvinist fantasies about a country you know nothing about.
My man, I lived in China. You don't have to sell me this bullshit.
Ah yes good old trust me bro, but even if you did it's pretty clear that plenty of people living in China disagree with you. Plenty of people live in US and can't define what capitalism or socialism is either. What makes you an authority?
You're right. A lot of people in China would probably disagree with me. But a lot of people in China lack the basic critical thinking skills to even question their circumstances, because secondary schools (if you even have the means to attend one) don't like students who ask too many questions.
A lot of people in the US would also disagree with me politically, because they think they were chosen by Jesus to oppress brown people and spread glorious capitalism around the world. But that doesn't make them right either.
I am a Marxist. I've done my homework. What do you want me to do, start quoting Zizek or Gramsci to pass your shitty litmus test?
China is an experiment in socialism gone awry, because like the rest of the world, those with power lust over capital. I lived in a T3 city in China where things were relatively quiet, but flew out to visit a friend way down in Shenzhen periodically. It's hard to see billionaire kids racing their Ferraris down the street there while the poor masses look down from the windows of their destitute coffin house apartments and think that this is somehow a socialist success story.
China is as capital-driven as any other world power. The government just likes to participate in it a bit more directly.
But sure, you're the expert, not me, so I'm sure this is all just capitalist propaganda intended to denounce great Mao zhuxi and sabotage the workers' revolution.
That's some racist shit buddy. People in China lack basic critical skills to question their circumstances, it takes a white savior to tell them what's up. Do you even listen to yourself? You'd not a Marxist, you're a racist.
If that's how you choose to read into my comment, there's no helping you.
Why would you even assume I'm white? Do you think I just moved to China on a whim? All Chinese people have to be born in China and nowhere else?
Fuck this.
There is no other way to read your comment. You're claiming that you understand China better than people who actually live there while claiming they lack "critical thinking skills" that evidently you believe yourself to possess. If you can't understand how unhinged that sounds what else is there to tell you.
Why would I assume that you're white? Because that's the typical narrative white American and European racists use, and if you're not white and you've internalized this narrative then there is truly no helping you.
Fuck this indeed.
I love all of the irony: Person 1: Americans don't question nor understand their system Person 2: Chinese don't question nor understand their system Person 1: WTF? Why you so racist? You sound like an ignorant white person
Americans don't understand their system, but it's pretty clear that they do question it given the political tension, and increasing amounts of riots that we currently see in US. These are the direct result of people being discontent with the direction their lives are taking under the US capitalist system. No amount of propaganda can trick people into thinking the system works for them when they see their lives suck.
On the other hand, vast majority of people in China support their government because they've seen their lives improve dramatically with each and every decade. That's the tangible material difference between the two systems.