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this post was submitted on 06 Oct 2023
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askchapo
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The CIA spent the postwar years doing all kinds of gross things, one of which was trying to move as many nazis to Ukraine as possible, with the specific aim of creating a fascist uprising in the USSR and possibly a Ukrainian fascist break-away state. They accelerated this program after the USSR coup, and the result is a modern Ukrainian state with outright neo-nazis in positions of power over the police, cities, and entire government. This is also why Ukraine doesn't bother to do the hilariously simple trick of just telling their troops to stop wearing white nationalist, nazi patches, or perhaps suggesting to volunteers using assumed names to stop picking "Adolf" or "Dirlewanger" or whatever - they are all part of an explicitly fascist national project.
Wow, that's... incredible. The CIA has done some fucked up shit, but that's something else entirely. Do you have a quality source on this? I'd like to follow up on this claim.
Edit: holy shit
https://www.cia.gov/readingroom/docs/AERODYNAMIC%20%20%20VOL.%201_0113.pdf <- legit from their own website
I don't trust NATO sources, do you have a youtuber?
It makes me so fucking mad how much of this shit you can learn just from their own declassified documents. They're not even trying to hide it
yet liberals will still scream "CONSPIRACY THEORY!!!" at you for pointing at things they publicly admit on the record lol
"Oh so now you believe the CIA?"
"We know the CIA did a lot of shady shit that's similar to what you're describing in the 50s, 60s, 70s, 80s, 90s, and aughts, no one involved was arrested, and there was no reform of the CIA, but they aren't still doing any bad stuff. They just stopped. You're a conspiracy theorist nut job if you think otherwise."
what in the goddamn fuck
I hope I'm alive to see how history will contextualize america's decades-long nazi support around the world in the context of wwi - russian revolution - wwii - cold war - whatever is coming.
When we consider the history of all societies to be the history of class struggles, it's maddening to think that chain of events as capitalists trying everything in their power to keep profits going and growing and combating workers that try to do take the next step. I also think wwii nazism is still not the worst that capitalists can possibly do to stop communism. The worst is still to happen and america will be the actor.
I've spent some time to find an account that's properly federated to Hexbear just to comment, because wow, if I never doubted that the U.S. were meddling in Ukrainian affairs (what with the leaked phone calls and all that jazz), I can see that the beast is way bigger than expected; it made me understand this server's perspective better. And to think they don't even hide it...
Honestly, even if you all didn't change your tone but just added this kind of links to your comments, you'd have an easier time convincing people.
I've been on hexbear for years and I didn't know this tidbit, although I was aware that GLADIO stuff like this has happened. Learn new things every time I visit here lol.
Oof, yet another thing where I saw the tentacle but not the kraken behind...
If you wish to understand the leftist perspective on the US beyond the "tankies just think everything the US does is automatically bad", I strongly recommend that you read Killing Hope and The Jakarta Method. Arming and supporting fascists to slaughter and subjugate everything that looked even vaguely socialist or just wanted to be unaligned during the Cold War has been business as usual for many decades and Ukraine is just a bullet point in a very long and bloody list. Fair warning: the stuff in those books can make you extremely angry. I legit had to put Killing Hope down and go do something else after going through the Guatemala chapter to shake off the utter disgust.
Thanks for the recommendations, and the links! If you'll allow me the redditism, username checks out. The missing pieces are falling into place, notably about NATO, which I didn't understand that well the hatred for; going down the rabbit hole of Operation Gladio mentioned by iie, and seeing how they've, for instance, supported extremist groups and commissioned terror attacks in my country with the U.S. pulling on the leash was a ride...
You're welcome. As always, I am asking liberals to read the Progress of Truth.
We should just get a bot to pin this to every new ukraine-related post
CIA: Undermining and Nazifying Ukraine Since 1953
This exact thought has created hundreds of thousands of marxist-leninists over the years. Stick around, you'll have a lot of these moments.
If you also accept people that feel closer to the anarchist ideals (not the "I'm free to do what I want, no rulez!!" type), I'll do.
I love my anarchist comrades.
I'm still in the infancy though, so, don't mind too much if there's some bad takes here and there; they'll eventually stop after more reading.
That tends to be how it goes. Bad takes in good faith are usually met with direct explanation. Hopefully that is your experience as well.
Yeah, you don't have to agree with everything to still be family.
Google "Project AERODYNAMIC CIA", the documents are all on the CIA's own website
Ever hear of The Jakarta Method?
I had not. I looked it up and have since bought the book, and just... I have no words that can really do it justice.
It's a lot, but it's a really good (and important) read. I found that, for me, it really hammered home how much of the conflict out there is class war where the nazi's and their adjacents ( neo-nazis, kkk, christo-fascists, mujahideen, etc) are ultimately just the foot-soldiers of capital against the workers of the world.
Unfortunately, The Jakarta Method just kinda scratches the surface of the horrors of the last century. I definitely recommend Vijay Prishad's Washington Bullets for a more broad overview of what Jakarta Method covers at an individual level. Also, The Blowback podcast is great, especially Season 2 if you're looking for CIA shenanigans. I've not read a book on it yet, but Operation Gladio is also pretty important when it comes to the CIA and supporting nazis and other fash.
When we say the CIA is the arm of satan, we aren't kidding.
Project Aerodynamic was one part of the CIA network of Ukrainian Banderite Nazis creating propaganda literature.
https://www.foiaresearch.net/project/aerodynamic
This nazi was the main guy involved in running the operation. Prolog Research was his publishing firm funded by the CIA to generate anti-soviet pro-Ukrainian nationalist books.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mykola_Lebed
The works published through Prolog later became incorporated into history curriculum to cement the false narratives they had established.
More about that here: https://www.villagevoice.com/in-search-of-a-soviet-holocaust/