this post was submitted on 03 May 2026
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Ye Power Trippin' Bastards
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Trying to equate Zionism with all Jews is antisemitic by definition. It doesn't matter if its 50% or 90% of Jewish people who support Zionism. It's a trap to do so since then you can be dismissed for being antisemitic, which seems to be the case here.
If all you are arguing is that the majority of Jews support Zionism, well that's probably true. But let's not fall for the antisemitic trap of judging every member of a religion by the worst examples. Otherwise we are no better than the folks who characterise all muslims as violent terrorists.
So if someone denies that the vast Majority of Jews are Zionists nobody is allowed to correct them because that's "antisemitic". Got it.
Nice throwing the false Muslim terrorist equation in there but the vast majority of Muslims do not support ISIS or any similar organisation. But if they did would it be Islamophobic to correct someone saying they didn't?
I think it's fine to point out that a majority of Jews are Zionists, but the implication that it's ok to judge an entire religion by it's worst members, even if they are a majority, is not ok. Because that's how we people make the leap from "death to Zionists" to "death to Jews". One is a statement of solidarity with the Palestinian cause. The other is just plain old antisemitism, disguised as social justice.
It isn't. Your stance is how we get Zohran Mamdani condemning protests outside a Synagogue selling stolen Palestinian land. Pointing out the systemic Zionism in Jewish institutions doesn't mean "wishing death upon all Jews."
You did just literally wish death upon 80-90% of Jews worldwide though. Doesn't that make you the antisemite?
https://ofpatmos.substack.com/p/fight-jewish-exceptionalism
If a synagogue is engaged in Zionism like selling stolen Palestinian land, then they deserve to be condemned for it. But not because they are Jewish, because they are Zionists.
Sure. I don't disagree with that. But the question is: do these synagogues not accurately represent Judaism if the overwhelming majority of Synagogues and Jewish religious institutions are Zionist? Because the OOP says they're not and I got banned only for correcting them that they are.
Someone mentioned below the majority of Christians are Zionist I agree with them. Nobody has a problem pointing out that most Christians are Zionist. and most Christinian institutions are Zionist.
But for some reason when you point out the same thing for Jews, somehow that's wishing death upon all Jews. In that case why wouldn't the same go for Zionist Christians being in danger if someone pointed out how deep the Zionist movement is within the (especially Evangelical) church?
The crux of this comes back to the belief that Jews in the modern day are an oppressed minority at the cusp of being thrown into the ovens again. Luckily my favorite substack author has also addressed this https://tariqacknickulous.substack.com/p/privileged-reality-of-jewish-demographics
Saying something like "An estimated 80-90% of Jews in modern time are also Zionists" with stats to back it up is perfectly fine to say, but it's also worth acknowledging the fact that "10-20% of Jews are not Zionists".
What you seem to be arguing is that, because Jews are majority Zionist, we should treat every Jewish person as though they are Zionist. The problematic part is in bold:
This is simply conflating Zionism with being Jewish as though they are the same thing. While the majority of Jews may well be Zionists (I don't know whether the 80-90% figure is accurate or not, but let's assume for the sake of argument it is), it's still wrong imo to characterize all Jews as Zionists. Like another poster mentioned, there are still potentially millions of Jews who do not support Zionism, and/or who oppose Israel's genocide of the Palestinians.
No, they don't - and you are making the same mistake again. Pro-Zionist Jewish synagogues cannot be said to represent Judaism as a whole, because not all Jews are Zionists, and not all Jews attend Temple. Why do you feel the need to stereotype all Jews, and all congregations as being the same? YDI.
Yes that's literally done by saying not 100% of Jews are Zionists but 80 to 90%. It'd be great if it was more. In fact most (especially European) Jews used to oppose Zionism until Zionist Jews worked together with the Nazis to literally kill off non-Zionist Jews and force the rest of them to become Zionists.
And now we're in the present where the equation has massively changed. And we're not talking about 55 or 60%. We're talking overwhelming majority numbers. 80 to 90%.
To dismiss the beliefs of 12 million people because of a max 3 million people not sharing their view doesn't make any sense. Why would the views of the overwhelming majority of a group not accurately represent them, but a small minority do? If this argument was about anything else but the percentage of Jews being Zionist, this wouldn't even be a debate. It 90% of Christians supported Zionism then Zionist Christianity would be an accurate representation of Christianity.
Why do you keep misrepresenting my argument which doesn't state that all Jews are Zionist but the majority are? Why is it "antisemitic" to simply correct this notion?
Because your argument is rooted in Liberal Zionism. I pick this battle because I actually support Palestine. Here's a much longer format explanation if you still don't get it after the articles.
Jewish Exceptionalism, Liberal Zionism, Jewish Supremacy - How YOU Inadvertently Support Israel
No, it's rooted in an understanding of how harmful majority stereotypes are. You completely ignored the bolded sentence which was the one I identified as antisemitic, and instead focused on the first sentence, which I agreed was fine.
You could safely reword it to something like "The majority of Jews support Zionism". That would be accurate.
Otherwise it's no different from claiming something like "80% of gay men are promiscuous [made up statistic btw]" and then going on to state "Promiscuity is accurately representative of male homosexuality" as though it were true for every gay man.
OP’s black-and-white thinking* leads him in these directions sometimes. He keeps getting mentions on c/meanwhileongrad despite not being a “tankie,” since dialectical materialism is the furthest thing from dichotomous thinking.
*I don’t mean to psychologize; the wiki entry just happens to be categorized as such.
Agreed, and it's an all too common mistake that I'm sure we have all been guilty of at one time or another.
Then you believe collective punishment is correct and justified. Where have I heard that one before...