this post was submitted on 30 Aug 2025
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I don't actually see a problem with this statement. I myself have said that describing it as a pretty heavy handed crackdown is fair in the past as opposed to a "genocide". They most certainly did carry out excesses too.
What matters is whether you recognise that's better than the western approach to extremism spreading within muslim communities - killing or indefinitely detaining them. China's model for handling this extremism was clearly better.
Not even. They only put people in those deradicalization centers who were caught consuming extremist materials. It's not like they discriminated against all Uyghurs. They did the opposite really, they censored the media so the rest of the population wouldn't harrass them for all the terrorist acts commited by people of Uyghur descent. Xinhua (now New China TV on youtube) has interviews of people who graduated from these internment centers.
And for anyone that hasn't seen it, here's a former colonel admitting to the CIA funding terrorism in China https://youtu.be/91wz5syVNZs?t=1342
People can still think that action you described is a "heavy handed crackdown", at that point it's an opinion up for discussion/debate. I certainly hope the topic was debated thoroughly internally to the CCP instead of making a rash decision.
i wonder if it's like Y2K prep or a pandemic and you're supposed to look like you over-reacted because you actually prevented what you were trying to prevent.
not to excuse any specific things, just the character of the criticism especially with the baseline lib take on china.
I'd say the ethnic cleansing of Tatars from Crimea following WW2 was an overreaction, but that too could be argued to be commensurate if we are just going by if it prevented what it was intended to prevent.
Iirc one of Tatar tribes in USSR send literally every able man to serve nazis during invasion, and there were Tatar divisions in SS being organised so it definitely weren't baseless suspicions.
And the Tatars that fought for the Red Army were also ethnically cleansed. This was a collective punishment against every single Crimean Tatar.
Would Israel be justified in ethnically cleansing Palestinians based on that Amin al-Husseini allied with the Nazis and said they had a common enemy in Jews and Communists?
I see you don't see the difference between "the suspicions weren't baseless" and "kill them all".
In this case we could easily see what was prevented, nazi satellite states genociding Jews and Slavs until they weren't needed too, as i somehow cannot imagine victorious nazis counting Tatars as "Aryans". We are fortunate that it didn't come to fruition because nazis were pushed quickly out, but again this is the benefit of the hindsight, if you call in the Palestice comparison, i bet it would be different tale even here if someone invaded Israel at 8th October. I bet zionists would not be kissed on hands and given pats on the head.
The thing it was intended to prevent was further unrest in Crimea from the Crimean Tatars where many wanted national sovereignty (had been a thing since they were annexed by the Russian Empire in the 18th century). Them having goals of sovereignty made them an easy target for foreign powers (Something that the Russian Empire used prior to annexing Crimea in fact). Crimea was also a strategically important province (much as it is now) due to its location.
WW2 was over, and the Soviet Union was fine and dandy to allow the Tatars who fought with the partisans and fought in the red army continue to fight and die for the cause until the end of the war before ethnically cleansing them. If we are writing fanfiction where the Nazis spontaneously rise again from being completely crushed by the Soviets we may as well say that they could have invaded the Levant and would have had merry compradors that weren't considered Aryan in the least until it became convenient in order to weaken British power in the region at which point they became True Romans and Aryan.
Anyway, are you saying that it was justified or not? Because you're awfully defensive about the ethnic cleansing.
Especially considering the history of Tatars capturing and enslaving Russians
i think it's fairly obvious that we are not "just" that criterion
I found a YouTube link in your comment. Here are links to the same video on alternative frontends that protect your privacy:
Is this a change of tune for the dbzer0 admins, or has this always been their stance? It's remarkably fair considering the source, even if it isn't correct.
Big change of tune
That's what I thought, makes sense though. The mods have been friendly with me as of late.
From what I can tell, you've been putting in the work out on the federated side
Thanks! That's actually why it's kinda surprising to see the dbzer0 mod team soften their views on Marxists, I try to leave dbzer0 alone but have gotten into arguments with the admins before.
Speaking from experience, nothing makes a budding leftist seriously investigate the facts of Marxism like being cast out and designated a communist enemy by others. Maybe I'm wrong, but I think we'll see an accelerated realignment now that db0 is officially part of the...uh, tankie quad bike. Like it or not, they're with us now.
I'm still of the mind that dbzer0 has a while to go before being fully outcast by the libs and fash, but I do think it will accelerate the alignment, you're right. My "multipolar Lemmy" theory I made a year or two ago may finally come true.
I... Love.... ~~Democracy~~... Federation...
Beautiful.
Just need a few more instances and we can finally get those tank treads and really start tankieing all over the place!
I notice liberals offer a lot of upfront resistance to heterodox viewpoints, but they like being smug and correct so they'll take the opportunity to stew on it and come around (at least in part), but it takes like actual weeks. I also know this because it's how I sometimes interact with my own liberal tendencies.
Makes sense! I do get people thanking me over dms from time to time.
It's not an opinion I personally hold, but it's an opinion which is within the range of acceptable good faith discourse
I think some of them are coming from the idealist position of "there should've just been nothing bad happening at all, so a crackdown on extremism is still bad." just wanting a perfect solution that inconveniences no-one.