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[META: serious and constructive discussion thread (radlibs will be yeeted tho)] You can both criticize the lackeys of capital AND vote for the ones slowing down the degeneration into fascism a bit (files.catbox.moe)
submitted 3 months ago by alsaaas@lemmy.dbzer0.com to c/leftymemes@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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(img translation: "Wind-up toys with a common key")

However, expending all your energy and agitprop potential on getting ppl to vote for the good cop instead of the bad cop, still legitimizes the dictatorship of capital (as well as it's sham democracies). It makes it seem like voting could solve systemic problems, instead of it just playing the game of late-stage capitalism. Anywayy.... that's my take (so probably incorrect)

This thing is a one-time thing tho, there is actually a sibling community for this kind of stuff: !actualsocialism@lemmy.dbzer0.com

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[-] dylanmorgan@slrpnk.net 27 points 3 months ago

Try to mitigate harm while still advocating for better.

[-] magnetosphere@fedia.io 20 points 3 months ago

Perfect is the enemy of good.

[-] hydroptic@sopuli.xyz 1 points 2 months ago

Perfect is the enemy of good enough

[-] Infamousblt@hexbear.net 11 points 3 months ago

The Democrats aren't doing anything to slow down a descent into fascism. In fact it could and should be argued they're accelerating it by not offering any reasonable alternatives to the type of populist fascism the American right offers. To be described as slowing fascism they would have to be actually doing something to slow it rather than letting it happen but tutting quietly about it. The only thing they're doing is spitting in the face of their constituents in favor of the asks of their capitalist donors.

[-] mindbleach@sh.itjust.works 8 points 3 months ago

The Idiot openly declared he'd be a dictator, just for a little bit. Just the tip.

He spent late 2019 through early 2021 committing high crimes to subvert the election.

Shut up about which team is making it worse faster.

[-] alsaaas@lemmy.dbzer0.com 7 points 3 months ago

Ofc they are accomplices in the machinations you describe. But I'd argue that their relative complacency/inaction/enablement - in comparison to the active/aggressive bs the reps are doing - is still preferable for socialists and just generally the 90%.

tl;dr: voting only by itself/as the only form of action only legitimizes the spiel of capital, but it does buy crucial time needed for socialist organizing.

[-] Infamousblt@hexbear.net 7 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

It isn't though, because it becomes harder for socialists to organize socialist-adjacent libs when said libs are convinced that "Well if I just vote THIS ONE MORE TIME things will get better." The lie the Democrats are selling is that they're actually a real opposition to the right, but it's a lie. They're using that lie specifically to draw people away from the promise of real change through meaningful action, and they reason they're doing that is to protect the interests of capital. Ask anyone who organizes how much easier the actual organizing part is when a Republican is in power; it's way easier because folks can't hide behind that "well maybe if we just try harder we can get the Democrats to care about us." Nobody feels that way when Democrats have no power so they actually engage with organizers. Logistically it might be harder, legally it might be harder, it might be more dangerous...but the actual human to human conversations are much easier when libs aren't under the influence of that "Just one more vote" lie, and that human connection is the thing that builds the kind of power necessary for the changes we need.

We gotta stop pretending like anything is easier or better under Democrats. They're good at making us feel like they are ignoring us or giving us space, but they aren't. They're actively hampering real action and real organizing.

[-] HobbitFoot@thelemmy.club 11 points 3 months ago

Voting doesn't mean you are barred from other political action. It is important to put political pressure on the people you vote for, including organizing for specific politics.

You don't need DNC permission to organize if you vote Democrats in the general election.

[-] agamemnonymous@sh.itjust.works 9 points 3 months ago

That kind of accelerationism is a gamble. Maybe it'll inspire a critical mass to socialize, or maybe they'll just get crushed under the boot. Uprising against the greater evil is a romantic idea, but it's by no means certain. If the evil is great enough, it could just crush the uprising. If you're going to promote that gamble, you have to acknowledge that it is a gamble, and everyone could wind up profoundly worse off of it doesn't work.

[-] HobbitFoot@thelemmy.club 6 points 3 months ago

And it is a gamble that hasn't paid off in history.

[-] squirrel@lemmy.blahaj.zone 9 points 3 months ago

One of the keys to strategic success is picking your battles. When you have the chance to choose the enemy you'll face, don't let fate decide for you. At the end of the day, you are going to fight, so pick the fight with the enemy you think you have a better chance of defeating. Take this whichever way you want.

this post was submitted on 31 Mar 2024
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