this post was submitted on 05 Oct 2026
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19
How have UK schools got so bad? (sh.itjust.works)
submitted 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) by ReconciliationTime22128@sh.itjust.works to c/asklemmy@lemmy.world
44 comments fedilink hide all child comments
 

Teacher numbers are falling, provisions and resources seem to be, widespread delinquent behaviour has been reported to be on the rise, and it seems like they’re refusing more and more to enforce the rules on such behaviour, but if you turn up with the wrong haircut or wearing trainers, all hell breaks loose. Obviously I can’t speak for every single individual school so some may not be like this, but I keep hearing about these issues. Are they real? If so, what is the cause? And what can be done to fix it?

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[–] Denjin@feddit.uk 39 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

There's a dedicated sector of the media (funded largely by foreign powers and billionaires looking for profit) who only want to make you feel like your country is collapsing. These are people opposed to even the concept of the democratic nation state.

Britain's schools are in fact among the best in the world, based on Pisa rankings (an internationally standardised measure of the quality of education in a country):

https://educationbycountry.org/pisa-rankings-by-country/

Are there issues? Of course, same as everywhere but it is simply false to suggest that things are as bad as your post is suggesting.

[–] _haha_oh_wow_@sh.itjust.works 9 points 2 weeks ago

It's also worth noting that these monied interests often attack educational systems (Reagan republicans called this tactic "starving the beast") because a poorly educated population is far more easily manipulated compared to one that's been taught how to think and reason critically.

[–] ReconciliationTime22128@sh.itjust.works -3 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

To be clear: I can only go off what I’m told and what I see, so if I’m in error, it’s only because of that I’m shown/see. That said, the guardian recently published a report on sexual assault in schools. I’ll have to try and find the article.

[–] Denjin@feddit.uk 16 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Like I said, there are real problems, but these aren't unique to the UK or new problems that exist now that have never existed before.

[–] ReconciliationTime22128@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

No, of course not, I’m not disagreeing at all. It’s just (and as you said, it literally could just be the media twisting the narrative so to speak) it is being made out to be getting worse. That plus one of my friends they say that their kids school has stopped punishments for not doing homework — basically letting the kids get away with not doing work. So I just was curious is all.

[–] LH0ezVT@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

I went to high school in a European country until the early 2010s. I just stopped doing homework and nobody really cared (they pretended to, and would tell you to do it, to which you would nod and smile and maybe do the bare minimum next time and then conveniently forget it again). My mom largely tells similar stories from her post-68 youth.

[–] ReconciliationTime22128@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Wow.

[–] LH0ezVT@sh.itjust.works 6 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

Yeah.

I now hold a trade degree, a bachelor in engineering and a master in CS, my mom had an economy degree, worked as vice department head for one of the largest companies back then before she took a maternity break, and did an open university remote bachelor in natural sciences afterwards because she was bored in her public service job.

Not bragging, well, maybe bragging a bit, but I'm trying to say that doing homework is not a great measure for success in schools and life.

[–] ReCursing@feddit.uk 11 points 2 weeks ago

You hear about them because "good news is no news" as the saying goes. You don't get reports like "School children are well behaved for 342 day in a row". You do get reports like "GCSE results are up again this year" most years though. Problems that there are likely related to the same problems that have cause a rise in the far right - underfunding, misappropriation of wealth and blatant stupidity by those in charge, and media pushing a narrative to drive sales.

[–] roofuskit@lemmy.world 4 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (2 children)

Your country has responded to every financial crisis in recent history with austerity. You left the EU to your financial detriment. Your country is now as poor as the state of Mississippi in the US, that is very bad.

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/2026/07/uk-productivity-economy-reform-party/687303/

[–] deHaga@feddit.uk 16 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (3 children)

It's not as poor as Mississippi lol. When adjusted for local costs and essential out of pocket expenses like healthcare, the UK’s median purchasing power and living standards comfortably exceed those of Mississippi.

Infant mortality rate

UK 4 per 1,000

Mississippi 10 per 1,000

Life expectancy

UK 81 years

Mississippi 71 years

A lot of Mississippi GDP is federal funding.

[–] roofuskit@lemmy.world 8 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

The UK just hit these levels. Mississippi has been this poor a LONG time.

[–] deHaga@feddit.uk 7 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

Yeah, sure. There are 4 of the world's top 10 universities in the UK. It has the 3rd largest tech sector behind USA and China. It has the 2nd largest global financial hub after New York.

GDP per capita tells you nothing. UK has 70m people, Mississippi 3m.

[–] Yeahigotskills2@lemmy.ml 4 points 2 weeks ago

I've always thought Lemmy-folk were pretty progressive and attuned to untrue news narratives, but the number of people I've met here who think the UK is a tyrannical hellscape, overrun by immigrants where people have zero freedom and much of the country has 'no go' areas for white Christians genuinely surprised me. But hey, what do I know, I've only lived in the UK for 49 years.

[–] disregardable@lemmy.zip -1 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

And it wasn't always poor. In the age of cotton, people made fortunes in Mississippi. When the industry lost its value, the rich took their money and left. Nobody is leaving London, but the rest of the UK? They need to invest in their population's ability to produce.

[–] MajorMajormajormajor@lemmy.ca 7 points 2 weeks ago

the age of cotton

Hrm, I seem to recall something else happening at that time that made cotton profitable. Just can't quite remember what it is...

[–] CompactFlax@discuss.tchncs.de 4 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Plus - the economy of England is two countries: London, and the rest. Massive wealth disparities.

[–] roofuskit@lemmy.world 1 points 2 weeks ago

Yup, the article talks about how London is carrying the average.

[–] LodeMike@lemmy.today 1 points 2 weeks ago

I'm sure GDP per capita is 2x Mississippi's

[–] ReconciliationTime22128@sh.itjust.works 2 points 2 weeks ago (3 children)

So you think school issues are primarily a financial issue? Can you explain?

[–] The_v@lemmy.world 11 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

"Teacher numbers are falling"

Teacher's leave because of lack of pay and a bad working environments. Then schools decided to save money by not backfilling the position.

"provisions and resources seem to be"

cutting teacher resources = more money out of pocket for most teachers for their students. Another reason teacher numbers are falling.

"widespread delinquent behaviour has been reported to be on the rise,"

When parents lose hope and are struggling to survive what's the point of pushing education? When a teacher loses parental support, student behavior is one of the first things to get bad.

"and it seems like they’re refusing more and more to enforce the rules on such behaviour, but if you turn up with the wrong haircut or wearing trainers, all hell breaks loose. "

Admin and teachers are at a loss on how to reverse the student behavior trend. Without widespread parental support their hands are tied. So they find often focus on "coming down hard" on negative external trends they can identify, the so-called "gang-related" activities.

[–] ReconciliationTime22128@sh.itjust.works 5 points 2 weeks ago

Well put, very good explanation. Thanks for clarifying

[–] ReCursing@feddit.uk 4 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

One word: underfunding. Pretty obvious really. Schooling costs money, and like anything else if there's not enough money to buy the stuff and pay for the people then corners will have to be cut, and corners can only be cut so far before quality suffers

[–] ReconciliationTime22128@sh.itjust.works 2 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

I do agree that funding undoubtedly pays a large role in the issues, but I can’t help wonder if, for example with behavioural issues, it seems like with the rise of youth gangs and youth violence up and down the country, most of which happens outside of school, if there could be other factors at play (obviously delinquents outside of school will become delinquents in school, which further fuels bad behaviour)

[–] schipelblorp@sh.itjust.works 2 points 2 weeks ago (2 children)

gangs and youth violence

Oh, dear.

Would you care to share your media diet with us?

I'm not from the UK so I can't tell you if you're being exposed to garbage propaganda, but gangs and youth violence are evergreen topics for at least trashy local news, and usually given an ethnic spin by the more explicitly conservative outlets.

[–] ReconciliationTime22128@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)
[–] schipelblorp@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

I mean, what channels do you watch, what papers do you read, what podcasts/radio do you listen to?

[–] ReconciliationTime22128@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

Podcasts/radio, none. I read the news (BBC, guardian, itv, etc.) plus government guidance documents.

Edit: oh and scientific journals/articles

[–] schipelblorp@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Guardian's pretty much the only criticism of the United States I read, and I live there. I imagine they're pretty good in their home country.

I don't know much about the beebs or itv, though.

How do the scientific journals find their way into the mix? Do you seek them out per-subject-area or do you just read them as they come along?

If you'd like to share, there's a good lemmy's for that: wildfeed and goodreads (or longreads?)...

[–] ReconciliationTime22128@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 weeks ago

Well, ‘scientific’ journals in the loosest sense — mainly papers published by academics on these topics I should’ve said instead.

[–] ReconciliationTime22128@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Also see the official government report on the matter and similar matters: https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/6a06eb37c0cc74b4523e4e8c/youth-justice-white-paper.pdf

[–] schipelblorp@sh.itjust.works 2 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

There's two approaches you can take to any social problem:

  1. Moral judgment. People are acting this way because they are amoral/culturally degenerate/etc. Solution: Send them to church / jail / introduce corporal punishment in schools, etc.

or

  1. What are the causes and conditions that contribute to this behavior? If teenagers are getting pregnant, do they have access to birth control and sex education? If teenagers are joining violent gangs, do they have a reasonable hope for a future (and are their fathers all in prison (see 1, above?). If there is a lot of homelessness, are jobs, menal health care, and housing available? Etc.

You'll find if you like feeling good about yourself (if you're doing well), the first option is very emotionally appealing. But if you actually want things to get better, 2 is your only option.

[–] ReconciliationTime22128@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

I do prefer option 2 tbh

[–] schipelblorp@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

I'm going to link you to a post that describes the causes and conditions of the current weltanschaung that might escape sociologists. It's not science, exactly, but I find it a good potential cause for all the social rot we're experiencing.

https://sh.itjust.works/post/67063299

From another, related angle, we're entering into some global chaos at the moment. The myth of perennial progress, holding our collective psyches together since the dawn of the Enlightenment/Industrial era, is falling apart. Scientific progress has stalled and, even if it hadn't, there is no spiritual sustenance to be drawn from examining ever smaller segments of space-time.

I've been reading about Gnosticism and alchemy, and apparently this is a recurring pattern in history. If you look at 1-2 AD Europe, you'll see much the same despair; the Roman Empire was falling apart, the future was uncertain, institutions were failing (and, I might add, internships (ie college) were incurring lifelong debt)... from that chaos we got the highly structured worldview of Christendom, but before that we have a lot of work that is more spritually resonant with the despair of today.

I'm reminded of that Yeats poem: Things fall apart, the center cannot hold.

[–] ReconciliationTime22128@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Why thanks!

[–] schipelblorp@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Yeah, sorry to be such a downer. I'm at war with myself. On the one hand, I want to be data driven and learn and make changes that improve the world (or at least cosplay that), and on the other hand, I think the world is an interlocking set of systems that play out regardless of anything we do; AND anything we do can be just be seen as an expression of that systemic playing out.

[–] ReconciliationTime22128@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 weeks ago

No problem at all pal, it’s all good :)

[–] roofuskit@lemmy.world 2 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

In addition to all the commentors talking about the actual funding of schools and pay for teachers. There is a well established link between the financial stability of a home and the performance of students that come from it. Struggling families have struggling students.

Social issues often are financial at their roots.

[–] ReconciliationTime22128@sh.itjust.works 1 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Good point

[–] roofuskit@lemmy.world 1 points 2 weeks ago

There's also a huge dropoff in academics when there's a concentration of poverty.

Mixed income schools with mixed income classes aren't nearly as affected. The more poverty in a classroom the harder it is for those struggling students to get the time and attention they need.

[–] Treczoks@lemmy.world 4 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

Conservative Gouvernment. They like expensive private schools, preferably the boarding type, for the rich. The working mob needs only enough school to do their menial jobs.

[–] Blisterexe@lemmy.zip 1 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) (1 children)

I'm a socialist and even I can admit the UK tories have been actually really good on education, seven of the past ten tory administrations have had the same education minister, and he presided over a considerable rise in average test scores.

[–] eldebryn@lemmy.world 1 points 2 weeks ago

Test scores are not that strong of an argument if you ask me.

Development of critical thinking, forming functional adults, understanding over simply repeating subjects, a culture of sharing and respecting. Proper intelligence and development, cultivating talents and diverse skills.

This is what schools are supposed to do. Not to get the average from 65% to 70% in classrooms full of feral, phone-addicted teens that bully their teachers and are neglected by their parents.

[–] ExLisper@lemmy.curiana.net 2 points 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago)

Same as everywhere else, where schools are failing: not enough funding.