this post was submitted on 20 May 2026
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[–] AlataOrange@lemmy.blahaj.zone 9 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Carnist here, feel free to ratio me in the comments.

The thing that I find most annoying in these intermittent "debates" where various people with different believes make starwmen and yell past one another is the shocking disconnect between people and the food that they eat at a fundamental level.

I am firmly of the belief that people need to be aware of what goes into the production of the food that they eat and look at the consequences of their actions directly.

People who eat meet but divorce that dish from the animal who made it are misguided at best to delusional at worst.

Similarly people who champion the removal of animal products but won't look into the eyes of a combine harvester and the animal it has ran over, the displacement or slaughter of animals in the clearing of farmlands, the increase in water consumption as new areas are turned over to fast cash crop agriculture based on whatever the current trend is, the removal of byproducts from industry such as long lasting leathers of adhesive products in exchange for quick rotting fast fashion made largely of petroleum products, and the costs associated with all of that are also misguided at best to delusional at worst.

Independence and community support are the best answer. But when so many see the people they live alongside as enemies what hope do we have of cooperation.

So maybe instead of fighting one another over petty concerns we can come together and take a look at the system trying to keep people apart and reliant on its own monstrous excess

[–] Tiresia@slrpnk.net 11 points 22 hours ago (1 children)

Similarly people who champion the removal of animal products but won’t look into the eyes of a combine harvester and the animal it has ran over, the displacement or slaughter of animals in the clearing of farmlands, the increase in water consumption as new areas are turned over to fast cash crop agriculture based on whatever the current trend is,

Animal products require the cultivation of more plants than vegan food. Animals need to be fed, and they burn tons of calories to stay alive.

the removal of byproducts from industry such as long lasting leathers of adhesive products in exchange for quick rotting fast fashion made largely of petroleum products, and the costs associated with all of that are also misguided at best to delusional at worst.

Without subsidies, it is cheaper to make long-lasting bioplastics from plant matter than to raise a cow and kill it for its skin. The fashion industry makes clothes that decay in order to sell more clothes, and the meat industry artificially lowers the price of leather.

So maybe instead of fighting one another over petty concerns we can come together and take a look at the system trying to keep people apart and reliant on its own monstrous excess

Agreed, you should take a look at the system and let go of your petty concerns. This will make you vegan.

[–] Alkali@lemmy.ml 1 points 18 hours ago

"Without subsidies, it is cheaper to make long-lasting bioplastics from plant matter than to raise a cow and kill it for its skin. The fashion industry makes clothes that decay in order to sell more clothes, and the meat industry artificially lowers the price of leather."

This post is why we can't have nice things.

Also, is this true? This feels like one of those statements made with confidence that may also not be true. I know bioplastics still have issues with regard to synthesis that does not have environmental impact and breakdown after synthesis. Also, corn is also heavily subsidized. It's kind of difficult to take this comment at face value given the unnecessarily personalized debate strategy you utilized.

[–] garbagebagel@lemmy.world 38 points 1 day ago (4 children)

I'm allergic to everything. Mushrooms, soy/tofu, tree nuts (but not peanuts), raw fruits (and some cooked), raw veggies.

I'm Mexican but even I can only eat so many beans in one week. I'll stick with doin my best though.

[–] ProdigalFrog@slrpnk.net 1 points 14 hours ago

From a climate/environmental perspective, just reducing or eliminating beef makes the most impact. Chicken and fish use far less resources and causes far fewer emissions per lb.

Thanks for wanting to help out :)

[–] seeking_perhaps@mander.xyz 5 points 22 hours ago

I genuinely think this is one of the few good reasons not to be fully vegan. Props to you for still doing your best despite how frustrating all those allergies must be.

[–] fushuan@piefed.blahaj.zone 21 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

Reducing meat intake and replacing it with veggies where you can does heaps for the environment. Your best is phenomenal, if everyone did your best, I bet the industries would adapt and offer more alternatives you aren't allergic to, so you had more choice to evolve what "your best" is.

Sadly this is probably going to be a generational change, multi generational even, so please don't chastise yourself for not being able to do more.

Me for example, I try to use vegan/vegetarian ingredients where I can but I'm lazy and also eat meat every 2-3 days. The moment I learn of a new lazy healthy product that tastes good I introduce it to my diet, it's a slow process lol.

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[–] arockinyourshoe@lemmy.world 16 points 1 day ago (1 children)

Don't go vegan. Don't go crazy on meat either.

Eat Billionaires instead

A beige farmer will thank you

[–] cloudskater@piefed.blahaj.zone 3 points 16 hours ago

This vegan can make an exception for the ruling class :3

[–] wraekscadu@vargar.org 26 points 1 day ago (2 children)

To the non vegans willing to approach this with an open mind:

I would highly recommend you to watch this.

Ethical reasons aside, if you do care about the environment and climate change, then vegan diets have a much much lower negative environmental impact.

If you're smart with it, then vegan diets tend to be a lot cheaper too! Most humans are lactose intolerant. Maybe you are too. If you are, then switching to vegan milks could mean less gases, farts and bloating. It's quite comfortable to not have all that...

That being said, if you do switch to a vegan diet, you would quite likely need vitamin supplementation (at least I do).

[–] mech@feddit.org 17 points 1 day ago (2 children)

Fun fact: People who eat meat from factory farming (virtually every meat eater) also rely on vitamin supplementation.
Only with extra steps: The cattle get the supplements. Cause they don't graze on lush natural meadows anymore, they're fed mostly corn.

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[–] UniversalBasicJustice@quokk.au 2 points 1 day ago (1 children)

What vitamins do you need to supplement?

[–] lookingforanALFpolycule@lemmy.world 2 points 20 hours ago* (last edited 20 hours ago)

Vitamin B12 (if you don’t eat any vegan meat and cheese substitutes since those are often fortified), vitamin D (everyone should supplement this, not just vegans) and iron if you’re pregnant.

[–] nutbutter@discuss.tchncs.de 21 points 1 day ago (3 children)
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[–] GimmeUrBelt@lemmy.today -1 points 15 hours ago

I believe in equal rights for all living things. Plants get the axe, same as the meat-bags.

[–] FishFace@piefed.social 9 points 1 day ago (16 children)

Is it 2012 again? I thought we'd grown past this dumb shit

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[–] Ek-Hou-Van-Braai@piefed.social 11 points 1 day ago (12 children)

Devils Advocate: Some reasons outweigh others.

The list of why you should never get on a airplane is also very long.

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I'm just here with popcorn, don't mind me.

[–] thiscat@lemmy.blahaj.zone 6 points 1 day ago (1 children)

im not vegan however i do want that animals would not be treated in the way most industrial farms treat them

[–] bushparty@sh.itjust.works 11 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (4 children)

Fair enough. Now do something about it….

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[–] Berengaria_of_Navarre@lemmy.world 8 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (2 children)

It's expensive, I like cheese, I like baked goods that don't involve chickpea water, I occasionally like meat, I like mead, all vegan cheese is truly awful.

Also any meat substitutes are always substituents for highly processed fast food which I don't eat anyway. As far as I'm aware there's no vegan alternative to coffee encrusted venison with a red wine reduction.

Also don't get me wrong, I do eat vegan food, I'm just not prepared to exist exclusively on it.

Also eating meat doesn't make you a bad person. There are like 8 people in the world whose company I can tolerate for more than a few minutes and two of them are obligate carnivores.

[–] rumschlumpel@feddit.org 2 points 15 hours ago

Beans are cheaper than meat or cheese, and tofu is also pretty affordable (whether it's cheaper than meat or cheese might depend on your specific locality).

[–] terranoid@lemmy.cafe 18 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

It's really not more expensive unless you're doing stuff like, quitting hot dogs then eating vegan special hot dogs, or buying vegan branded goods, or eating out at vegan branded restaurants, or tons of vegan ground beef and cheese. You would want to make more whole food recipes that use cheap ingredients.

In fact it's way cheaper if you're making beans and rice and veggies from scratch. It's essentially the cheapest diet you can have if you do it that way. Poor diets are usually beans and rice, or lentils and stuff like that. And not canned beans, but make beans in a crock pot or something.

A little bit of meal prep goes a very long way at making it the cheapest diet you can eat while still having good nutrition and protein. I'll cook up two pounds of dry black or pinto beans and eat it throughout the week. Doesn't take much effort at all either, especially with an instant pot.

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