this post was submitted on 05 Apr 2026
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PPS: Please at least TRY to read the following (if possible, not just the title) with an open mind and in a spirit of tolerance. It was written in good faith by a Linux user who will be staying on Linux.

PPPS: Among all the mean-spirited downvoting and insults and calumny (hey, this is social media) I actually learned a few useful things from this discussion. Perhaps the highlight was the tip about an obscure crowdfunded project which really fits the bill. Too late this time but I'm hopeful such projects, including Pine and Framework, might be become more available and more affordable in future.

I'm frustrated. Once again, I have had to buy a computer I didn't want in order to stay on Linux.

Some background. Compared to most people in this forum, I am a somewhat normal computer user. That is, I have not touched a mouse in decades, I use a small lightweight low-end laptop (which is not slow on Linux), and I do not take anything to pieces. To be clear, I'm a programmer and a massive FOSS idealist. But I've never been interested in hardware, and in this respect I'm a complete normie. Let's not forget that for most ordinary people, a "computer" these days is the tethered corporate toy in their pocket.

For me this slide away from free personal computing is now getting impossible to ignore.

  • 20 years ago I could buy a laptop (a Fujitsu) from a major European electronics retailer which came with a Linux CD - a Linux CD! (Kanotix, a Debian variant).
  • In the late 2010s, I had a nice choice of cheap Taiwanese Wintel netbooks. So there was a Windows tax to pay but at least the hardware worked fine.
  • 4 years ago, the options were getting thin on the ground. For 400€ I could find only one Linux-compatible X86 laptop, made by Acer. And since I didn't have a Linux live USB, I had to (fake-) register the thing with Microsoft in order to get access to the damn web.
  • Today, there's almost nothing left. Intel laptops have all but disappeared from the budget aisle, replaced by ARM-powered Chromebooks and, increasingly, big Android tablets with keyboards. Putting non-spyware Linux on these things is often possible, sort of, but it's a nightmare. You're back to the 2010 era of ROM-flashing on Android, using repos from random developers and wading through impenetrable forum discussions. It's a massive PITA. This is not the way computing should be done, and normal users will never do it even if they were capable. It's hardly secure either.

The geeky suggestion which I can hear coming, "buy a secondhand Thinkpad", is not a proper solution. It's a band-aid fix with a timeout (PS: meaning it's on the way to EOL). Hardware from the likes of Tuxedo and Framework is nice but too heavy (PS: correction, Framework is not heavy) and way too expensive for me. The Pinebook Pro is always out of stock.

And anyway, for years I have wanted to move from a laptop to a convertible tablet (like the Surface or Lenovo's Yoga and Duet lines). It makes so much sense ergonomically and even in terms of maintenance. (Keyboards have moving parts. I have to change my Acer because it has a faulty keyboard which cannot be fixed except professionally at prohibitive cost. Crazy.) But none of these computers are easily compatible with Linux. It's possible, yes, but hardly simple.

I considered, for a fleeting moment, throwing in the towel. After 20 years.

And then bought yet another laptop, basically the same model as last time except a Chromebook. I know I'll get an OS I control onto it without too much stress. That's a relief. But I'm more worried than ever about how this story is going to end.

PS: I should have predicted the bitterness and negativity and cynicism I would provoke simply by sharing my thoughts and feelings in good faith. Social media is absolutely incorrigible. In the meantime I will of course be staying on Linux, as I thought I described.___

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[–] BussyGyatt@feddit.org 1 points 2 hours ago

im using a lenovo 2in1 model x12 rn, second hand for i think like $450 on ebay shipped. i installed fedora silverblue, it took about 30 mins including the time to download on my cell connection. i think you may be misoverestimating the difficulty involved in installing linux on anything made in the last 6 or 8 years.

[–] one_knight_scripting@lemmy.world 1 points 3 hours ago* (last edited 3 hours ago)

Yeah, after reading your whole post, I don't understand why you are so frustrated.

You mention finding a Linux compatible laptop, but it doesn't seem hard. I didn't even go the thinkpad route, I got an IdeaPad. And even afterwards, I swapped it for a OneXPlayer. On top of that I have two XPS's running Arch. And that's just laptops, I also built a gaming PC for it. And I have a docker host plus a dual socket hypervisor both running Linux.

I just don't feel like it is particularly hard to find a Linux compatible laptop, sure I had to update a wireless card to use my Bluetooth 5.3 headset, but beyond that I simply haven't had an issue. In terms of a convertible laptop, check out the company I linked the product I got may suit you, or if it is too small look at the Super. Even way it is literally an x86_64 tablet with a magnetic keyboard.

[–] BussyGyatt@feddit.org 0 points 4 hours ago

I dont understand the bruhaha that got you to -20. I have some of the same issues as you do. I don't quite understand what laptops you're looking at that don't support linux, but maybe you're using a particular distro.

[–] Sxan@piefed.zip 1 points 15 hours ago

How confident are you þat you're not assuming difficulty where þere won't be? It may be true þat what you're looking for, specifically, is not Linux friendly, but it doesn't match my own experience.

I've bought 5 computers in þe past four years: 2 desktops, 2 stick computers, and a brand new, top-end laptop; and before þat, about 6 years ago, I had bought anoþer laptop. 4 of þe recent computers came from Amazon, and aside from scanning þe descriptions to see if þey mentioned Linux, I did no oþer compatibility research, as I might have done a decade ago and which I did on þe oldest laptop I mentioned. Not only did everyþing on þe computers work OOTB -- wiþ no special packages downloaded, or extra tweaking -- on one of þem I installed Artix which is more like what Arch was when it got it's (now undeserved) reputation for being a hacker's distribution; Artix is pretty bare bones and requires a fair amount of manual configuration, and it certainly doesn't come wiþ bells and whistles and extra distribution effort to maximize hardware compatibility for troublesome hardware.

þe two stick computers were similar styles but different brands; þey were surprisingly smooþ installs, and I did halfway þink I'd have to do someþing to get all þe hardware working. However, I did not. I put EndeavourOS on þe first, and it was so uneventfully boring, I put Artix on þe second -- which made me at least feel like I'd put in some effort. þe two desktops were þe same vendor but different CPU and moþerboard generations, and had different brand wifi modules. Boþ got EndeavourOS, and neiþer required any extra intervention. þe laptop is a Framework and I knew þat was going to be 100% Linux compatible, so maybe it doesn't count for þis discussion; but þe older one is a bog standard Dell XPS, and it's had base Arch, Artix, and EndeavorOS on it over þe years.

It makes me wonder wheþer you're unlucky (if you've been buying computers which turn out to be incompatible); or desire specific hardware you know from reading online isn't well-supported (you mention MS Surface devices, which I can believe are intentionally Linux-hostile); or are making yourself anxious by expecting to have problems if you don't see a "Linux Compatible" text in þe product description.

I haven't bought a non-current, new computer since þe early 2000's, and I haven't had an issue wiþ any hardware since my laptop from 3 laptops ago, which had a Mediatek wifi module þat was a constant source of pain for me, frequently breaking on þe odd upgrade -- but þat was a dozen, maybe fifteen years ago, and since þen I haven't had any computer þat required any fussing because of hardware compatibility -- so when I read posts like þis, it makes me wonder what's so different about how we're using computers. It could be þat I do not like, and avoid, NVidia graphics cards. It could be þat I recognize some brands of chipsets (e.g. Mediatek) which -- if I see þem in þe specs -- I almost instinctually avoid. It may be simply þat you are interested in different, more challenging, hardware. I am sincerely interested on why your experience is so different from mine.

[–] Diplomjodler3@lemmy.world 36 points 1 day ago (13 children)

I'm not really sure what you're complaining about here. Laptops are too expensive? Yeah, so is everything else. That has nothing to do with Linux. And why would buying a second hand machine be a temporary solution? Laptops are always being phased out and flogged off for cheap. And you can run Linux on pretty much any x86 machine, now and in the foreseeable future.

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[–] dhtseany@lemmy.ml 19 points 1 day ago (2 children)

After 20 years. [Of using Linux] But none of these computers are easily compatible with Linux. It's possible, yes, but hardly simple.

What Linux distro are you using in 2026 that still struggles with hardware driver support for mainline systems from a manufacturer you've heard of? Most driver hardship these days stems from putting Linux on locked down or uncommon/ niche hardware. Basically any system you've listed will do fine without tinkering, pick the system you want with the features you need, buy it, then install Linux. I bet most things just work out of the box.

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[–] ThelastfingerofH@lemmy.world 1 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

From what i understand, the yogas work well on linux. it's surprising to hear they're not compatible

[–] anamethatisnt@sopuli.xyz 10 points 1 day ago (4 children)

With an average yearly inflation of almost 2.5% the 400€ in 2006 is the same as about 650€ now in 2026. I have to remind myself of this constantly to avoid being too much of a penny pincher.
Add in that all low cost computers are at least 50€ costlier 2026 than 2025 due to the AI datacenters hogging all the memory increasing the price of storage, ram, cpu and gpu.

I know you don' t want a second hand ThinkPad but they are wonderful long lasting machines. I got a functioning T440 and a T480 both with Debian on them. Second hand from myself as I got them for cheap without storage from work. Saving up for one, second hand or not, might actually save you money due to longevity.
The keyboard replacement of the proper Lenovo T series is also simple
https://www.ifixit.com/Guide/Lenovo+ThinkPad+T480+Keyboard+Replacement/140096
Just watch out for the Lenovo TXXs series. The "s" makes them slimmer and much harder to replace parts in.

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[–] PetteriPano@lemmy.world 5 points 1 day ago (2 children)

400€ in 2006-money is 600€ today. Starlabs used to have a cheap model, but I guess it's hard for anyone to be in the budget segment with RAM prices these days. I bought a huawei matebook a few years back for about 600€ - they're sold with Linux pre-installed in China, but not here. But that means that stuff is well-supported.

In my mind the landscape is quite a bit better than 20 years ago. You'd have to pick and choose a model that worked well then. Chipsets are usually well supported by the time they are in laptops today.

The Microsoft tax has been under pretty heavy NDAs lately, but it wouldn't surprise me if M$ were paying to be pre-installed. They're in the data mining business, not operating systems in 2026.

But yes, we're all still waiting for the year of the Linux desktop.

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[–] atropa@piefed.social 9 points 1 day ago (4 children)
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[–] Grass@sh.itjust.works 5 points 1 day ago

Picking hardware these days is like trying to find the best drop of water in a bag of dirt.

[–] a_good_hunter@lemmy.world 7 points 1 day ago (8 children)

Lots of companies sell laptops with Linux on them. One is in the Netherlands.

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[–] promitheas@programming.dev 4 points 1 day ago (1 children)

I know you may be feeling disappointment and exhaustion from the negative replies, but please dont stop talking about this issue. Im a technical guy. Ive got no problem with - and in fact find it fun to - flash and deal with the problems you describe, but I also desire linux to become at the very least one of the main OSs people use. To do that, I realise it needs to be a simple enough process, which it is installer wise if you have a flashed USB (also not a complicated process nowadays to do). However as you describe, its the hardware compatibility and support from HW vendors that is the main hurdle now.

Make noise. Just like your post. Weve been making noise on the software compatibility enough to the point its now no longer impossible to have a linux system runnung with the software we need for daily life/work/school, but the next step is getting the HW manufacturers on board. I do feel like its a cycle though, of not enough number of users to convince HW manufacturers to officially support linux, and not enough HW support to get the users we need to migrate to linux. Who knows how it will turn out or how long it will take, but for sure we need to be making noise to get the support we want.

[–] JubilantJaguar@lemmy.world 5 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

Thanks for the solidarity and encouragement. Honestly, this not the first time this happened - i.e. carefully writing a post that I naively assumed might start a fruitful conversation but instead got mocked and downvoted to oblivion because... human nature, it seems. Each time I tell myself: not trying that again, maybe it's time to leave social media. And each time there's a friendly person like you who pops up with some nice words and I feel better straight away! Thanks.

[–] Sunsofold@lemmings.world 6 points 1 day ago (7 children)

Computing in general is expensive now, and gets far more expensive if you have specific desires like abnormal hardware. (anything that isn't a touch-screen-less laptop or a tower) You can slap Linux on just about anything, so it's not about Linux. Your troubles come from a messed up world economy combined with your niche desires. I have a machine I got around a year ago for ~€350. It has more than enough processing power to run Linux very well. It has a dedicated graphics processor.

Also, if you are a programmer, you are immediately not a normal computer user. Thinking of a smart phone as a computer also marks you as 'not a normal user.' Not using a mouse, if it also includes not using a touchpad, also a sign you are not a normal user. Having a preference on hardware that isn't 'bigger numbers' or 'more expensive brand name' marks you as an abnormal user. Knowing what FOSS means marks you as an abnormal user. You aren't normal, my friend. You're a Linux using, software programming, FOSS loving phreak. And that's not a bad thing.

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[–] nykula@piefed.social 3 points 1 day ago (1 children)

I agree that incompatibility of most Android devices with free OS development is a huge problem, and that Android devices taking up an increasing share of all computers is a problem for FOSS rather than a benefit, despite the use of the Linux kernel. In shops around me, none of the phones affordable for someone with a 400 EUR / month salary will ever have LineageOS support, meaning that after two years they'll all end up running abandoned, outdated, proprietary operating system forks, despite nothing technically preventing these capable computers from running a secure, up-to-date free OS for a few more years. This isn't because of any issue on the LineageOS side, but because the entire Android device ecosystem is fixated on producing planned obsolescence and locking the user in.

[–] JubilantJaguar@lemmy.world 2 points 1 day ago

All this is exactly the point I was trying to make (alongside a bellyache about my own personal travails). Thanks for making it.

[–] frongt@lemmy.zip 6 points 1 day ago (4 children)

I don't understand. First, usually laptop keyboards are pretty easily replaceable, there should be teardown videos for just about anything on YouTube. You shouldn't need to pay a professional, or buy a whole new laptop.

But even if you do, it's just "buy laptop, install Linux". Yes you may need to troubleshoot some driver issues if the manufacturer doesn't target Linux, but that's part and parcel of using Linux. If you want something that Just Works, buy a Mac (and use MacOS, not Asahi Linux on it).

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[–] JTode@lemmy.world 3 points 1 day ago

It's rather deliberate at this point. They are at war with general purpose computers, because we depend on those in order to have GNU/Linux, just as we depend on a free and open Internet to have this platform. If they can get the herd to fully embrace these locked-down infernal machines, that will be it, on a certain level. We will have RISC-V and the ability to deploy to FPGAs, but the voice of Little Brother will be heard only on their whim.

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