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‘If 1.5m Germans have them there must be something in it’: how balcony solar is taking off
(www.theguardian.com)
That's 4' 11" - I had no idea Germans were so short.
this post was submitted on 11 Feb 2025
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I wonder why only those people have balcony solar. Why aren’t other Germans interested?
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My dumb ass: “Is it just 1.5m Germans, or other heights too?”
M in million should always be capitalised for this reason.
1.5M Germans vs 1.5m Germans
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For first few seconds, I deadass though they are talking about Germans with a height of 1,5 meters.
Only Germans this high have balcony solar
Makes sense, taller Germans throw too much of a shadow to make the solar worth it.
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Home solar indicates a massive management failure of public utilities. If it is more cost effective and more pleasant to generate your own electricity without any economies of scale, something is very wrong.
Source: I live in California where the “public” utility is an absolute disaster that charges $.60-$.70/kW/hr so anybody who can afford the upfront cost of solar has done so.
Microgeneration makes way more sense to me. If you generate the power where it is used without pollution, we should. The unfortunate piece is we have to many landlords who's interest are too divorced from their tenets to put up more microgeneration
These microinverters aren’t made of fairy dust. Doing this stuff at utility scale uses a lot less nasty minerals and chemicals.
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If you generate the power where it is used without pollution, we should.
Generators take space, require maintenance, and have a certain optimal capacity that isn't necessarily hit on a given roof.
For wind energy in particular, the bigger the turbine, the more yield per $ spent. If you go out to Corpus Christi you'll see these enormous turbines - $10M to $50M / ea - that generate on the order of $24 to $75 per MWh, or $.024-.075/kWh. Home wind/solar don't get anywhere close to that.
Prime placement of units, distribution across a wide area, and a degree of storage capacity means you're going to get better and more consistent yield.
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By putting the solar panel at a 90 degree angle though it is much less efficient than e.g. a 45 degree angle.
Less efficient than not having them?
Wrong question. The right question is: is the solar panel able to be CO2 neutral (at least) or CO2 negative. We don't get anything out of it if producing the solar panel costs more CO2 emissions than it saves by producing electricity.
Before you ask: I don't know the answer. I was looking into this thread in hope to find it.
Most people don't care about being CO2 neutral. The real question is what is the ROI? Will the panel save that person money. If it takes 50 years to pay for itself, I'd say that's bad. 10 years is more standard. 5 years I say it's a no brainer. Though I suppose you can also argue value for utility, if that is giving her the ability to power something off grid that would be worth something.
In Germany those panels usually pay themselves after about 5 years depending on the price of the necessary electronics (don't forget the electricity meter!) and if there's also a battery.
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To be a positive impact, they just need to be less carbon intensive thans the energy they displace. According to the first results on google, (presumably utility-scale) solar is about 12 times less carbon intensive than natural gas and 20 times compared to coal. So as long as you're replacing base load and not utility solar, balcony solar could be as much as 10 times less efficient and still come out a net positive.
Keep in mind also that these numbers keep improving as solar panel manufacturing becomes more efficient and starts using more green energy itself over the coming decades
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That pic is great, haha. Woman looks so smug.
i mean, it'll work. You should probably just collectively work together to install a solar array on the roof of the apartment instead, assuming it doesn't already have one.
Granted this is in the EU, so ideal solar tracking is kinda just, fucked. It matters more closer to the equator, because you can get significantly more power from pointing them correctly, and tracking, if you decide to use that.
Rooftop solar has a huge upfront cost and requires the building owner/operator do it. It’s out of the control of individuals and out of their price range.
Balcony solar is completely under your control, within most people’s budget, and you simply plug it in
While tracking might let you collect more energy, you also lose more of your balcony, and you’re back to making the install expensive and complicated. Not worth it
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Why are you cooking for yourself at home? It would be more efficient, if you organize a shared kitchen in the house and each evening a different party cooks for everyone in the house.
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any form of collective project requires organization, which conveniently is not required for an individual project that can be as impulsive and unsafe as the individual wants.
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In b4 nimbys complain it's an eyesore despite most people never looking up
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My North-East facing balcony doesn't get enough sun light. But it's an interesting idea.
“Plug-in solar is part of the whole array of options,”
I don't understand how this works? For our system we need an inverter that cost about $3000.- (half if it doesn't have to handle a battery), and it needs to be installed by an authorized electrician.
For a small system as the one shown, the price of panels are peanuts, the 2 panels shown should cost less than $150 combined. While the cost of inverter and getting it connected is way way higher. There's a lot more to this than not being on the roof!?! But which isn't disclosed.
The article says nothing about how the power from those panels is made usable.
The "balcony" bit isn't the defining characteristic, it shouldn't be taken literally. Some people do have their "balcony solar power" on their roofs.
What defines it is limitation to 800 W and inverters that come with a normal Euro Type F ("Schuko") plug and no legal requirement for professional installation. A layman can literally plug it in to an existing wall socket. Given that they are capped at 800 Watts, the inverters are also the simplest type and dirt cheap (although often they are literally just software-capped and identical to higher power ones, make of that what you will). Complete systems (2 panels, cabling, inverter) cost between 299€ and 800€ depending on quality. You genuinely only have to buy a fixture that suits your needs and a mate to help you install it.
Proper several-Kilowatt-systems are very expensive in Germany too.
Thanks really good info. 👍😀
A layman can literally plug it in to an existing wall socket
That's amazing, I had no idea that is possible??? Is that special for Germany? (sorry for keeping on with new questions). 😋 I've never heard of that option here in Denmark.
cost between 299€ and 800€
No wonder it's a popular option, our system is of course bigger with 11.2 kWh and 7.5 kWh battery. but it was $17000 1½ year ago. Prices have dropped to $12500 for a similar system, but still such an 800W system is dirt cheap by comparison.
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Read it as germans who are 1.5 meter tall, wondered why them being short is relevant.
Isn't wind energy better on balconies?
Sadly really small wind turbines are really ineffective and not worth the investment until you have a really windy balcony. If you only have a few square meters solar is the only choice.
But I'd still love to have a small windmill in my garden.
Hmm no,
- first oft all: noise. Wind turbines have moving parts, that attached to a building or even worse attached to a balcony creates noise in the whole building. Imagine the rattling of 5-6 ~10 year old, bad maintained, wind turbines.
- Second: the energy output is rather low. A 1,2KW turbine is about 1.2m/3.9feet big. That's in spherical, cause it has to be able to rotate by wind direction.
- Third: balconies are preferred to not have wind, but sun.
- And last but not least: blades. Every windturbine form factor has (fast) moving blades. If it's reachable someone is going to stick a finger in it.
If you're living more suburban and have a windy detached place to setup a small windturbine that's an option. On the garage or shed for example.
If everyone puts wind turbines on the balconies they might end up blowing the building over
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This is really nice! This is the future!
I'd love to know how much they produce, especially during the winter/monthly.
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