236
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
this post was submitted on 26 Jun 2024
236 points (93.4% liked)
Climate - truthful information about climate, related activism and politics.
5086 readers
857 users here now
Discussion of climate, how it is changing, activism around that, the politics, and the energy systems change we need in order to stabilize things.
As a starting point, the burning of fossil fuels, and to a lesser extent deforestation and release of methane are responsible for the warming in recent decades:
How much each change to the atmosphere has warmed the world:
Recommended actions to cut greenhouse gas emissions in the near future:
Anti-science, inactivism, and unsupported conspiracy theories are not ok here.
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
I think voters know and don't care because he's supporting a genocide. Its the elephant in the room and there is just no amount of whataboutism that will overcome it. The Venn-diagram of people for whom climate (or any progressive issue really) is a priority, but also not mindlessly slaughtering a people, is basically a circle.
No good thing that Biden has ever done matters so long as he's complicity supporting the genocide of the Palestinian people.
Joe's road to winning this election is very simple. Cut off aid to Israel and put 100% of the blame on Bibi. Make him your fall guy and then about-face on this issue and pressure the Israeli government into calling snap elections.
Boom. 5 days later and Biden will be polling at 55% and he can actually take advantage all of the "great things" he's done, which currently stand irrelevant because of the 9000 lb gorilla in the room which is a functionally pro-genocide stance. A worthless pier; air drops; sternly worded letters: they are irrelevant when the President has the tools to have stopped this from day 0 and he continually refuses to use them. This war is hurting the Israeli and Jewish people. Jews are less safe globally then ever before explicitly because of how Israel has engaged in this conflict.
The question at this point is who does the president work for? Does he work for the American people or the Israeli government?
This problem predates October 7, and we just had a candidate lose a primary in part because he sounded too much like he was supporting Hamas. So it's not that.
So AIPAC and Dems did this, not "because he sounded too much like he was supporting Hamas" what ever the fuck that BS is.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/elections/2024/06/13/clinton-endorses-bowmans-challenger-house/74082348007/
Again, Biden's position on Israel is central to this. Democrats have been consistently more interested in eradicating progressives from their party than resisting conservatives. If Biden had the same stance as Bowman on Israel (you know, the moral one to have), Bowman wins that primary.
Its over for the Democrats. They've lost this election and lost the future of the party to I don't know what. They've at least one entire generation of voters on this issue, and maybe as much as 40-60% of Z and millennials. They are dead as a party at this point and there is no point arguing about them because they'll never hold power again.
And its because of this issue. Its because of Gaza. Its because they are not interested in the priorities of their base, and have been telling us exactly this since the year 2000. We should listen to them.
That doesn't explain why people don't know about things that Biden has actually done on other issues though.
Humans have limited bandwidth for keeping active "issues" in their brains. We prioritize somethings over others. There has been plenty of press on Biden's climate "wins". But they are irrelevant because he's supporting a genocide.
Say a human can have maybe 5 priorities at a given moment. Anything that drops out of those five priorities means we don't "know" about it (its not at the front of our mind).
For likely Biden independents it goes:
1: Genocide in Gaza
2: Stopping Trump
3: The economy
4: The rise of christian fascism (nationally & globally)
5: The rise of authoritarianism
Climate can't get to the top of the heap because there are other issues, more prescient, are way way way more relevant in near-time. And this has always been the issue with Climate as politics. The costs to doing anything (with time as the x-axis) are always high (on the left side of the x axis, near time) while the benefits are low (in near time). The benefits are all extremely delayed. Humans didn't evolved to deal with this kind of shit. Historically when a population of humans fucked up their environment beyond the point we could survive (its happened a bunch of times), those humans just fucking die and whatever left of their diaspora get picked up by other human populations. We evolved to rank and prioritize issues for survival now, a little bit for 5 years from now, and basically not at all for 20 years from now. And practically 0 for issues 100 years from now.
So its not that people don't know about these W's; its just that they don't care. They can't. They have other shit they need to care about because its blowing up in their faces right now.
Palestine can't live forever if the middle east is too hot and dry to support human life. If what this article says about Biden's climate wins is true, then he will have done more for Palestine than any previous POTUS. Which is still next to fuck all, but I would consider it a bigger deal than his participation in the current genocide. We are talking about genocide of one human ethnicity versus genocide of all human ethnicities including the first one. There's no contest. And yeah, it would be very easy for Biden to genocide zero ethnicities, but I'm not Biden so I don't get to make that choice. I only get to choose Biden or Trump.
What you just communicated, is one of the most psychologically damaged things I've ever seen communicated on social media.
What in the chicken fried fuck are you talking about.
You are just pro-genocide dude. You are parroting what the Nazis parroted in their genocide of the Jews. That its good for them. That its better this way. You've lost your god damned mind and need to seek real professional help.
Yup, people who argue that Biden shouldn't be criticised for his genocide because "Trump is worse" are just doing genocide denial.
Even if you take the stance that he has to beat Trump to prevent an even worse climate disaster, his genocide might stop him beating Trump. He is choosing genocide and supporting fascism overseas rather than beating fascism at home.
People go on about how much we need to beat Trump but I'm pretty convinced that Biden and the DNC don't really want to beat Trump.
That's also why threatening to not vote Biden is useless - he won't care. Vote for him and force him to spend another 4 years disappointing and radicalising his own base against the US empire.
If beating Trump was the priority, you don't run Biden as a candidate.
It's so obviously true but libs can't accept it so they just come with the downvotes.
Oh I don't worry about these narcissistic, scared, desperate haters.
They've relegated themselves to the dustbin of history with the fact that their world view is unable to accurately predict future states of the world.
Are you saying I have a mental illness because I disagree with you on politics?
There is a line where something ceases to be a difference in politics and becomes a person advocating for and justifying the eradication of a people.
That's you.
Your on the other side of that line.
Its no longer a difference of politics but a question of if you regard other humans as humans or not. and your on the wrong side of that answer. And like with the "paradox of tolerance", if you aren't willing to accept the humanity of other people being inherently valuable, no one should be obligated to treat yours as much. In other words, if you can't accept the humanity of another people and this genocide is "justified" to you, no one is obligated to respect you as a human, because you've betrayed that social contract.
I didn't accept the genocide of Palestinians. In fact, I'm trying to stop the West Bank from being bombed as well. And you're not.
Also you didn't answer my question. Are you saying I have a mental illness?
single issue voters have always been a scourge to democracy. Whether they be "pro-life" and happily accept anything the candidate dumps out, as long as they control women's health, or anti-genocide and reject everything, even to the point of burning down their own country.
Very few people are actually "pro-genocide", but people need to balance everything.
it's still: genocide+lots of good stuff vs genocide+lots of bad stuff.
it's not a matter of whataboutism, because both sides are pro-genocide.
If genocide is all that matters, then you're a good person morally, but a bad American. Genocide SHOULD and DOES matter. But the topic shouldn't be your only defining political characteristic.
Shit Americans Say.
Nah man there are still a few progressives left here.
A few.
This sounds like jack-off centrism.
no. not in the slightest. it sounds like fucking nuance.
Or, you know, the philosophy of Joe Manchin.
never heard that name before in my life... 🤷♂️
Do you just not really pay attention to US politics? It was only like a year or two ago that his name was always being brought up.
If knowing that name is your sole metric for "not really paying attention", then by your standards, I obviously don't really pay attention.
Fortunately, my desire to care about your metrics is non-existent.