485
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
this post was submitted on 11 Jun 2024
485 points (96.4% liked)
politics
18017 readers
2897 users here now
Welcome to the discussion of US Politics!
Rules:
- Post only links to articles, Title must fairly describe link contents. If your title differs from the site’s, it should only be to add context or be more descriptive. Do not post entire articles in the body or in the comments.
- Articles must be relevant to politics. Links must be to quality and original content. Articles should be worth reading. Clickbait, stub articles, and rehosted or stolen content are not allowed. Check your source for Reliability and Bias here.
- Be civil, No violations of TOS. It’s OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It’s NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect!
- No memes, trolling, or low-effort comments. Reposts, misinformation, off-topic, trolling, or offensive.
- Vote based on comment quality, not agreement. This community aims to foster discussion; please reward people for putting effort into articulating their viewpoint, even if you disagree with it.
- No hate speech, slurs, celebrating death, advocating violence, or abusive language. This will result in a ban. Usernames containing racist, or inappropriate slurs will be banned without warning
We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.
All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.
That's all the rules!
Civic Links
• Congressional Awards Program
• Library of Congress Legislative Resources
• U.S. House of Representatives
Partnered Communities:
• News
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
As far as I'm concerned we only have one legitimate party at the moment and that's the one I'm going to vote for.
But, even though Biden isn't nearly as progressive as I'd like, he still beats the brakes off of any other democratic president we've had other than Jimmy Carter, so I wouldn't say he's doing a bad job per se.
If he were running against a "rational" Republican I'd still vote for him, so I wouldn't say I'm motivated solely by my hatred for Trump.
Biden, DNC, establishment Democrats and Boomer Democrat voters: Okay guys we need to figure out who to elevate in the 2028 Republican primaries who's just as vile as Trump so those uppity leftists will have to keep voting for our pro-corporate asses.
Not a single Dem has that power nor would have wished a GOP candidate as bad for America as Convicted Felon and Sex Offender Treason Trump.
I'm not expecting anyone as vile as Convicted Felon and Sex Offender Treason Trump although the GOP does have a knack for continually disappointing America with their bad candidates.
Corporations must be super mad at "pro-corporate" Joe Biden for raising the minimum corporate tax rate from 0% to 15% even though tax rates are the single thing that matter above all else.
The indispensible prerequisite for moving the Overton window to the left is for the GOP to lose elections. And leftist who doesn't understand that will automatically transform themselves into a perpetual Loser.
Factually false.
https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2016/11/hillary-clinton-2016-donald-trump-214428/
Factually true.
Regardless about what some random idiot reporter said 8 years ago, (1) no Dem has any powers to select a GOP nominee and (2) Dems aren't responsible for how terrible the RNC's nominees are .
Just did.
Learn about the electoral college. We're literally forced into this 2 party choice.
And nobody alive today created this. We all inherited it, just like you. It's just the reality and if you don't recognize that you are condemning yourself to be a lifetime loser.
Yes which Boomer Democrats exploit in the primaries.
So why can't leftists organize and overpower the boomer dems in the primary?
Because decades of being marginalized by Boomers have left generations after them trained to think their participation has no effect. Which is precisely the intention. You're happy it works right up until the point where we don't vote for your geriatric genocide supporting procorporate trash of a human being in the general election.
Yeah, I'm quite upset you would abstain and let a fascist walk in, sure. That is fair.
But you're deliberately avoiding the question. If leftists are so numerous and their views so popular, WHY CAN THEY NOT OVERPOWER THE BOOMER DEMS?
Face it- you do the same shit everyone else does. You cry and whine because you didn't get your way and you stop all effort. You didn't get every damn thing you wanted (besides student loans forgiven, medicare insulin capped, biggest climate bill ever, a president walking in a picket line, etc.) so it's time to give up? It's time to abstain because of genocide knowing the other actual choice would be FAR WORSE for Palestine (let alone everything else)? But hey, at least go go gadget would get to be all haughty and on their high horse saying "my conscience is clear" while everything gets worse.
Maybe be in it for the long haul and be the change you want to see. Again- if leftists are so numerous they should have no problem pulling AOCs all over the place and changing the landscape dramatically. The right can do it so why can't the left?
Again, I'm not upset you have morals and want to end the genocide in Palestine, etc. I do too. I want better healthcare (either nationalized, single payer, some universal with public/private a la Germany, etc.), I want better social safety nets, guaranteed parental leave, etc. I think a lot do.
I'm upset that people like you bitch and moan all the goddamn time and act as if you're so marginalized and so victimized that you not only abstain yourself but convince others to do the same, or don't vote in primaries, or don't volunteer, etc.
You need to face up to the facts- either leftist/progressive voters are NOT as numerous as you all think and you get represented precisely how much you should be given how big the tent has to be in a FPTP system or leftist/progressive voters are numerous and are simply extremely apathetic where they can't be bothered to turn out for someone that isn't basically their knight in shining armor. In which case, again, they get represented EXACTLY how much they should because they are lazy and flakey and not worth anyone's time courting.
I don't want to beat people down but I'm tired of people acting as if there is a huge groundswell of support. Study after study and election after election show that the issue is exactly as I described in the previous paragraph. Either show up and be counted or continue to whine when things don't go your way.
Thank you for saying this.
Team Red put in serious effort to drag this country hard right. They can taste victory in the air and have YUGE plans for remaking this country into the Authoritarian Right-Wing Dictatorship they've been craving since Bush's years. Fuck 50 years of Republican rule. They want a Permanent Republican Majority (for at LEAST 20 years), and they'll tear down Democracy (because that has to have something to do with Democrats, am I right) to get it.
If the Right functioned like the Left did, the Republicans would be locked out of the political system at the first hint of adversity. But they didn't, because the Right-Wing Shitheads' answer to RINOs was to organise and work to push them out of office in favour of hard-right ideologues. Vote for the Conservative in the Primary and the Republican in the General. That's their motto.
Right-Wing Shitheads win when people like go_go_gadget convince our voters they should sit home because they didn't get exactly what they want. It's all hands on deck to stop a naked Fascist takeover of the country, and we need to be calling the idiots on our side out whenever they push these memes that the best answer to feckless politicians on our side is to take your ball and go home.
To all of you saying stay home or vote third party, this is exactly how the country keeps shifting Right.
I haven't been staying at home or voting third party and that doesn't seem to be working either.
It is. Really, it is. Just look at what Trump did to everything you supposedly care about from 2017 through 2020. I said in 2020 that had we elected Hillary Clinton POTUS, we'd at least not have backslid as hard as we did from 2017 to 2020. But people had to express their displeasure at Hillary, and stayed home or voted Third Party, and from 2017 until 2020, they got what they voted for, hard, without lube.
It's the same thing now in 2024. Biden HAS made concrete gains in areas I'm interested in, ranging from investing in green energy, pushing for domestic chip production, and standing up for minority rights in all areas. Trump plans on reversing all of that and then some with his Project 2025. Stay home and get Project 2025.
No it keeps shifting right because Moderate Democrat voters and Establishment Democrats sabotage any and all efforts to move it left.
Because America isn't a progressive country, progressive ideas are not popular, and outside of the Internet most Americans are perfectly happy with the heinous and stupid bullshit their government does as long as the news is full of SLAMS and DEMOLISHING opponents
And I say that as a progressive who's shown up and been counted in every election for the last 24 years.
Make up your mind. If you didn't need us to win the 2020 general election you don't need us in 2024.
Student loan forgiveness was rejected by the supreme court. All the loan forgiveness you're seeing is the result of the PSLF program signed by G.W. Bush in 2007. Are you trying to give Biden credit for something Bush did?
Boomers got what they wanted. Yay.
Sure. This isn't nothing. However you should compare what's in the IRA compared to what was in the BBB. The BBB is what Biden and Bernie worked on together. The BBB did not pass. This was a very disappointing outcome.
Fucking bread crumbs. Biden blocked the rail strike. The rail workers were fighting for 15 sick days. Some have 7. Most have less than that. Some sound byte by an IBEW administrative worker doesn't change that. Our votes are worth more than that.
You don't get to define what is "everything we wanted". Biden does not deserve our votes. Our votes are worth more than what he's done. If you don't like it find someone else to vote for your procorporate trash candidate.
Okay Ivan. You are speaking for yourself and nobody else, unless its Putin. He damn well deserves our votes. But if you hate that he raised taxes on corporations which is what they hate the most, then you aren't one of us.
Removed, civility.
Removed, civility.
Your vote is worth shit because you don't use it.
Then Biden won in 2020 without my help and you can ignore me and anyone who thinks like me. 🤷♂️
Of course that means you'd have to blame somebody else if he loses in 2024. My vote can't simultaneously not matter in 2020 and be 100% responsible for the outcome of 2024. You need to pick a lane.
The rest of us picked Team America. We don't give a shit about what Putin wants to do.
Thanks for that GOP. And you trying to get them in power.
Sorry Ivan. I know how jealous you are that my country is the most successful country in the world.
Ok Ivan. I've never even been to St. Petersburg.
they never made such a claim. in fact, all the evidence is that dems don't care if leftists vote at all.
Since Dems are leftwing all the evidence is the exact opposite of your claim.
https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/19/politics/barack-obama-speech-transcript/index.html
Obama in 2020: This president [Trump] and those in power – those who benefit from keeping things the way they are – they are counting on your cynicism. They know they can’t win you over with their policies. So they’re hoping to make it as hard as possible for you to vote, and to convince you that your vote doesn’t matter. That’s how they win. That’s how they get to keep making decisions that affect your life, and the lives of the people you love. That’s how the economy will keep getting skewed to the wealthy and well-connected, how our health systems will let more people fall through the cracks. That’s how a democracy withers, until it’s no democracy at all. We can’t let that happen. Do not let them take away your power. Don’t let them take away your democracy. Make a plan right now for how you’re going to get involved and vote. Do it as early as you can and tell your family and friends how they can vote too.
barrack "I'll kill you at a wedding" Obama, barrack "I lied about closing gitmo" Obama, barrack "expand the surveillance state Obama is not going to tell me what to do.
this is also not evidence that Democrats even know where the left is.
when you get me a democrat that wants to close the prisons and the banks and end the institution of private property and the state, I will vote for them.
At this point, you're asking for a communist. Good luck trying to get that going in the states.
And you're asking us to elect procorporate trash.
No.
I would also accept a libertarian socialist. liberals aren't leftists, though, and Democrats are liberal at best. some are much worse.
That's on you and nobody else. It's incredibly stupid for people to think your participation has no effect. Dems typically beg people to participate in every primary and election and the GOP typically hopes few people participate.
What a pathetic deflection away from the fact that Democrat boomers are still boomers and vote like the selfish pieces of shit they are.
yes, we understand that you don't like boomers.
They voted like shit bags for decades and we're all paying the price. Yes.