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this post was submitted on 03 Oct 2023
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askchapo
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I am absolutely not worried about people's personal choice to have kids or not. I am worried about a how much "antinatalist" rhetoric there is amongst what is considered the left, which is actually just recycled malthusian and neo fascist talking points. I am worried about how many people can't have kids not because they chose not to, but because they think that they can't afford children.
The right wing cultists having families of seven kids are a very small minority. Most people with right wing political views simply don't want to do that. In most western or industrialised societies, people are still having less kids on average, regardless of political views.
I am pretty sure they don’t just “think” it, but they actually can’t afford them under our current system
The bourgeoisie will never struggle to have kids, that's kinda the most significant materialist factor for any kind of difference in birthrates across ideological lines.
How is it evil or fascist to think having kids is wrong? They aren't saying "disabled people having kids is wrong" or "black people are out breeding white people". It's "no one should have have kids". Unless they secretly mean only white people should have kids (which doesn't seem to be the case?) it doesn't seem evil or fascist. A moral position you don't hold, or find odd, but I don't understand why that would be evil.
Like, some people think birth control is immoral. That's doesn't make them evil, unless it's part of something else (white Christian values are being replaced and you need to defend against it).
as a personal preference, its whatever. as a political ideology, the whole point is to oppose people having children. using political machinery. does that really not sound problematic to you?
Antinatalism should be a ban on sight. It's completely reactionary trash on par with denying the existence of enbies.
There is nothing inherently reactionary about antinatalism as a philosophical stance, but I suppose parts of it could be cherry picked and packaged in some sort of genocidal propaganda. It wouldn't be the first time fascists did something like that.
I'm curious as to your understanding of antinatalism, since you consider it reactionary.
My own understanding: Someone who is never born is incapable both of a) experiencing and causing suffering (inevitable part of life) and b) missing positive experiences (as well as being missed themselves).
Having children is a central part of our biology and therefore our society, so I get that most people react negatively and never spend time and effort on the subject. It's one of those beliefs people are more likely to come to on their own than being "enlightened" by a 30 min vid. I think it is partly responsible for me now being vegan, at least the two feel closely connected as far as my values and beliefs go.