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Surzhyk: why Ukrainians are increasingly speaking a hybrid language that used to be a marker of rural backwardness (theconversation.com)

submitted 2 weeks ago* (last edited 2 weeks ago) by lvxferre@mander.xyz to c/linguistics@mander.xyz

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Key points:

The word surzhyk (суржик) ['surʒek] in Ukrainian originally refers to a mix of grains, or a flour made with that mix. It's being used to refer to a "mixed" Ukrainian + Russian linguistic variety. Kind of like Spanglish, but more like Portuñol.
The Russian invasion of Ukraine shows people in central and eastern Ukraine using surzhyk more, and Russian less.
Acc. to the text the surzhyk being used nowadays is markedly different from the one used in the 30s, as if the mix was originally "some Ukrainian with lots of Russian" and nowadays "some Russian with lots of Ukrainian".
Attitudes towards surzhyk seem to be changing, too; from negative to positive.

Note: there's no way around politics, when it comes to language; it's an intrinsically political topic. However, I'd like to ask other users here to keep any potential discussion on-topic for this community. Also, please do not conflate populations with governments, OK?

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[–] lvxferre@mander.xyz 3 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

When it comes to portuñol I'm pretty sure the ones I heard in Ciudad del Este (PY) and in Rivera (UY) are two different beasts:

CdE - mostly code-mixing, indeed. Fairly unstable, in one sentence a speaker says one thing and then the next sentence they use the equivalent in the other language.
Rivera - certainly not code-mixing. It's better described as a divergent Gaúcho Portuguese variety, with heavy Rioplatense Spanish influence. There is some internal variation, like /ṼC/ vs. /VnC/, but it already got its own rules, apart from both PT and ES.

I'm really not sure on surzhyk, though. I wonder if it's a similar situation, some being code-mixing and some being already their own "stable" varieties.

[–] ViatorOmnium@piefed.social 3 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

In Uruguay, they have a dialect of Portuguese that is often called portunhol, but is distinct of what most Portuguese and Spanish speakers would call portuñol/portunhol, because it's a stable dialect. And Ciudad del Este might be a similar case.

[–] lvxferre@mander.xyz 1 points 2 weeks ago

Ah. It's that dialect I'm talking about. I always heard people referring to it as "portunhol", at most "riverense".

One thing that caught my attention in that variety was people using [ʃ] for a few words both PT and ES would use [s]; for example

Riverense [ʃẽ.pɾe]~[ʃem.pɾe] "always"
Portuguese [sẽ.pɾe] ⟨sempre⟩
Spanish [sjem.pɾe] ⟨siempre⟩

And Ciudad del Este might be a similar case

Not really. In CdE it's mostly that quick-and-dirty mix while you're buying/selling stuff. The city is a commercial hotspot for Brazilians because it allows you to buy imported stuff without paying import taxes (they're outrageously high in Brazil).