this post was submitted on 20 Dec 2025
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For those who aren't familiar with the term, it means believing something that probably shouldn't be believed, or being influenced to believe something that's not necessarily in your best interests.

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[–] bunchberry@lemmy.world 2 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago) (1 children)

Even if all Stein votes went to Clinton, she still would've lost, so the country ultimately followed your strategy of not voting third party. You need to take responsibility as the current situation we are in is the result of your endorsed strategy.

[–] ChexMax@lemmy.world 1 points 1 day ago (1 children)

I mean, not really. You just said it wouldn't have made a difference if I voted for Stein vs Hillary. I got several lifelong Republicans to change their voter registration to Democrat to vote for Bernie. I do not endorse voting 3rd party anymore. I used to think you should vote your conscience no matter what. I believed in a free and fair democracy. Now I think you should strategize even if the democrats suck too.

I do take responsibility for being a dumb young 20s person falling for what I now think was Russian propaganda, but Trump winning a second time had nothing to do with me. That's on people who didn't vote at all in 2024.

[–] bunchberry@lemmy.world 0 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

I mean, not really. You just said it wouldn’t have made a difference if I voted for Stein vs Hillary.

I am not talking about "you." I have no idea who you are. I am talking about your strategy. People followed your strategy and it got us into the bind we are currently in.

I got several lifelong Republicans to change their voter registration to Democrat to vote for Bernie. I do not endorse voting 3rd party anymore. I used to think you should vote your conscience no matter what. I believed in a free and fair democracy. Now I think you should strategize even if the democrats suck too.

And people have followed your strategy and it failed. It turns out that having no principles and endorsing warmongering fascists who promise nothing to their constituents will just make you lose the election.

The point of voting third party isn't even necessarily some expectation that the third party wins, but to pressure the Democrats to actually stand for something so that the Democrats will win. Your strategy of "vote blue no matter who" always leads to the Democrats not only losing, but also shifting farther to the right before losing because they have no incentive to have any populist principles, and then this hands the reigns into an even farther right Republican administration.

Again, Trump's victory is a result of your strategy. This administration is yours. Own it.

People did not vote third party in this election in significant numbers enough for it to sway the election. People did not do so last election either. People have been consistently following the "vote blue no matter who" for decades now, with the last time there was any serious backing for a third party was back in the 2000 election.

I do take responsibility for being a dumb young 20s person falling for what I now think was Russian propaganda

Russiagate in 2025 🤦‍♀️

Yeah, I'm sure it was those few hundred dollars in ads on Facebook and not open support for an industrial scale holocaust, an out of control cost of living crisis, shifting towards being jingoistic and running on wanting to massively ramp up military spending and constantly attacking Trump from the right saying he isn't hawking on the border enough.

Yeah yeah, I'm sure none of those had to do with people not being very inspired to vote for the Democrats. Democrats aren't popular because of a few Facebook ads, not because they've done anything wrong! Sure sure.

but Trump winning a second time had nothing to do with me.

You take no responsibility for anything. You just constantly want to shift the blame elsewhere. Your failures are all secretly the fault of Russia or of other poor and struggling Americans. The problem is never you or your beloved fascist politicians. You do not have the level of maturity needed to admit when your strategy has failed.

That’s on people who didn’t vote at all in 2024.

It is the responsibility of a party to have a strategy to attract voters. Saying "we should have a strategy that appeals to no one" and then losing the election and blaming people for not voting for you just reveals that you, at the end of the day, genuinely do not care about the outcome of the election. This is why you try to shift the blame of your own failures onto other poor and struggling Americans.

I want the Democrats to appeal to non-voters so they will actually win. You want the Democrats to appeal to no one and then just shame non-voters as bad people for not mindlessly your beloved fascist politician, because you ultimately, at the end of the day, don't actually even care if the Democrats win or lose as politics is just a game to you. I want a strategy that actually wins elections. Your strategy has been the dominant one for decades now. As the old saying goes, insanity is trying the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.