i house a homeless person in my own apartment, im not rich. and its ridiculous to act like 500k is how much you need for a 2 bedroom (where are you housing people, downtown manhattan??), in fact housing homeless people is incredibly cheap to do, many are even on disability and can pay for their own food, just not housing.

so yeah i do have a standard, to do at least what i do when youre that rich. and i know people that have less money than me that do this too! and yes, i have housed homeless people that i knew for a total of 5 hours prior

edit:

for the audience, it should be noted that homeless people are systemically segregated and considered untouchable. its basically impossible for them to get housing even when they have a job and money due to bad credit. opening your home to them can often save you money because you can buy in bulk together and prepare food together. this is the essence of mutual aid. it is the individualist mindset that considers these people a burden for not living up to the capitalist system's standards.

[–] CyborgMarx@hexbear.net 6 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

While you may be a valiant person, it is the height of libshit to demand people open their homes up the minute they catch a purse

Individualistic and burdensome solutions to systemic problems is libshit and demanding this standard of other people (even millionaire lefists) is unreasonable

Also 500,000 is what two bedrooms are going for in large parts of LA, you're not American so maybe you forgot how ridiculous US home prices are

[–] kristina@hexbear.net 8 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

While you may be a valiant person, it is the height of libshit to demand people open their homes up the minute they catch a purse

i get it, you see other people as a burden

Individualistic and burdensome solutions to systemic problems is libshit and demanding this standard of other people (even millionaire lefists) is unreasonable

its not the complete solution but to have that much money and not to help people in the most effective way that you can just shows a lack of humanity and a refusal to truly decompile your supremacist thinking. housing people directly is cheap, easy, and the basis for mutual aid (handing people money is not mutual aid).

calling the real foundation for mutual aid individualistic... projection YOU are individualistic for thinking someone suffering outside is 'burdensome'.

Also 500,000 is what two bedrooms are going in large parts of LA, you're not American so maybe you forgot how ridiculous US home prices are

im a dual citizen, i live in an apartment in america. there are plenty of places, that while theyre boring, are walkable and affordable in america. its just not in a big city like LA. given his wealth he could easily afford a property outside the city to help people with or house someone in his own house. ive done this even when i was living with my own family. you can make excuses (oh i dont have enough bedrooms, oh i dont have enough space, oh it would be awkward), these are all individualist. if someone is in danger they do not give a fuck about any of that, they will sleep on your couch or in your fucking closet they dont care. this is a you problem, not a them problem.

[–] CyborgMarx@hexbear.net 5 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

its not the complete solution but to have that much money and not to help people in the most effective way that you can just shows a lack of humanity and a refusal to truly decompile your supremacist thinking.

Except Hasan has helped people using his purse, the man has raised millions for mutual aid orgs and charities, so your premise is just dead wrong

You simply don't like the way he's done it and apparently think mutual COHABITATION (which apparently is also the "foundation of mutual aid") is the only meaningful way someone with money can individually demonstrate praxis, which again is the height of unreasonableness

YOU are individualistic for thinking someone suffering outside is 'burdensome'.

I didn't say homeless people suffering is burdensome, I said the expectation that you as an individual is obligated to solve homelessness the minute you acquire any money IS burdensome and individualistic, that may not be the case for you, but pretending that's a reasonable expectation for other people is unreasonable and you know it

[–] kristina@hexbear.net 8 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

Except Hasan has helped people usimg his purse, the man has raised millions for mutual aid orgs and charities, so your premise is just dead wrong

Plenty of billionaires and millionaires do this, and 99 times out of 100 its a highly ineffective way to help people that is mostly a good way to get their taxes reduced and to make themselves feel better. I'm curious what specific orgs he donated to, even. I bet you the directors take 100-200k/yr cuts.

You simply don't like the way he's done it and apparently think mutual COHABITATION (which apparently is also the "foundation of mutual aid") is the only meaningful way someone with money can individually demonstrate praxis, which again is the height of unreasonableness

It fundamentally is the foundation, have you ever read Kropotkin, the guy that popularized the term? A family unit is often seen as the core fucking example of mutual aid. To have effective mutual aid, cohabitation (or living in proximity in a different housing area, which is difficult to do in American society outside of chance) is necessary. Just sending cash to someone is charity (albeit the most effective form of charity, which afaik Hasan does not partake in). You also have a reduplication of efforts if you become too spread out, making the mutual aid highly inefficient.

I didn't say homeless people suffering is burdensome, I said the expectation that you as an individual is obligated to solve homelessness the minute you acquire any money IS burdensome and individualistic, that may not be the case for you, but pretending that's a reasonable expectation for other people is unreasonable and you know it

It isn't unreasonable, what is unreasonable is the individualism-to-a-fault in American culture, even among supposed 'leftists'. To solve homelessness you must by definition fight for homeless people and see them as important as yourself, which you are clearly incapable of doing or even comprehending.

[–] CyborgMarx@hexbear.net 2 points 3 months ago (1 children)

I'm curious what specific orgs he donated to, even. I bet you the directors take 100-200k/yr cuts.

How about Number One funder of the Amazon Labor Union, what's the phrase? "No investigation, no right to speak"

It fundamentally is the foundation, have you ever read Kropotkin, the guy that popularized the term?

I'm not an anarchist, and that's all I'll say on the subject

To solve homelessness you must by definition fight for homeless people and see them as important as yourself, which you are clearly incapable of doing or even comprehending.

To solve homelessness you need STATE POWER, not simply individualistic quests reifying noblesse oblige

[–] kristina@hexbear.net 8 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

How about Number One funder of the Amazon Labor Union, what's the phrase? "No investigation, no right to speak"

That's fine I guess, but by your own standard that didn't directly result in the conquest of state power so you know, what a waste

I'm not an anarchist, and that's all I'll say on the subject

Me neither

To solve homelessness you need STATE POWER, not simply individualistic quests reifying noblesse oblige

Bro did you just call me a noble for helping homeless people not fucking die in the street peltier-laugh you dont need to be a fucking rich landlord with a heart of gold to do this thats the whole fucking point im making, it saves you fucking money even!

holy fuck america is so cooked, stop with this ridiculous parasocial obsession dude

[–] CyborgMarx@hexbear.net 0 points 3 months ago (1 children)

but by your own standard that didn't directly result in the conquest of state power so you know, what a waste

Almost like it's a process or something

Me neither

Then why bring up Kropotkin???

Bro did you just call me a noble for helping homeless people not fucking die in the street

Your inability to recognize your expectations for other people are over-the-top, is what I was calling noblesse oblige, not your personal activism, which like I said previously, is valiant

[–] kristina@hexbear.net 8 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

Almost like it's a process or something

Then how can you not understand saving someone's life, someone whose material circumstances makes them a likely socialist, is not part of a grand process? I've done this a lot at this point, you can just keep doing it, and its not even hard to do.

Then why bring up Kropotkin???

You said "The dude gives small fortunes to charities and mutual aid orgs all the time" as if you appreciated it. I was explaining the basis of what good mutual aid looks like, and it is rarely about the money (though a good mutual aid setup can save you money). It is best to directly house people if you want to use a lot of money efficiently and effect people in the most profound ways.

Your inability to recognize your expectations for other people are over-the-top, is what I was calling noblesse oblige, not your personal activism, which like I said previously, is valiant

This is a skill issue on your part and on the part of society. The white supremacist settler society will continue to do those things, yes, but to call yourself a leftist you must first decolonize your own thinking and be willing to see others as important as yourself.

[–] CyborgMarx@hexbear.net 2 points 3 months ago (2 children)

Then how can you not understand saving someone's life, someone whose material circumstances makes them a likely socialist, is not part of a grand process?

Did I say mutual aid wasn't part of the process? You made assumption about my "standard" not resulting in "conquest of state power" and I corrected you by calling it a process and now you're talking about how I don't include mutual aid in that process, which is another assumption???

You're shadow boxing with a phantom in your head and I'm catching strays, all because I called out your over-the-top expectation for other people, I wasn't making a value judgment on the concept of mutual aid itself

I was explaining the basis of what good mutual aid looks like, and it is rarely about the money

Again, I understand what you're saying, but I'm not an anarchist, under a capitalist system it's always about the money, I'm disagreeing with your theory and I said didn't want to get into it because I didn't want to make this sectarian

It is best to directly house people if you want to use a lot of money efficiently and effect people in the most profound ways.

The state can do that better than idealistic social expectations

This is a skill issue on your part and on the part of society

It's a skill issue because you don't have state power, that's my point

[–] kristina@hexbear.net 7 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago) (1 children)

Again, I understand what you're saying, but I'm not an anarchist, under a capitalist system it's always about the money, I'm disagreeing with your theory and I said didn't want to get into it because I didn't want to make this sectarian

I'm not an anarchist lmfao, ML all the way through

The state can do that better than idealistic social expectations

And you don't have one oh my fucking god thurston im not expecting the whole of society to suddenly decide this is the way to go, but you can hinge on the idea if you save the lives of 30 fucking people who will go on to say communist shit, that does in fact change something. like i get it, you personally are a sack of shit and will continue to be a sack of shit! have fun!

just keep jerking off to hasan, its praxis, bye!

[–] Nakoichi@hexbear.net 2 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Anarchist getting called a tankie solidarity ml getting called anarkiddie

Also fuck streamers I hate that I keep having to hear about these people.

[–] kristina@hexbear.net 2 points 3 months ago

:yea:

[–] Kappapillar@hexbear.net 1 points 3 months ago (1 children)

Hi comrade, just stepping in to say that I agree with your points throughout this thread, esp about reach/audience/impact vs. the idealism of being ideologically pure. Also you've been posting for several hours now. At this point don't worry about idealist and armchair leftists in the thread, there's better things to focus your frustrations on.

[–] CyborgMarx@hexbear.net 1 points 3 months ago

Yeah I'm done now, people are looking at upvotes instead of arguments, no point in continuing

Mildly critique someone's unrealistic expectations while describing what they do as valiant, and you still get called a "sack of shit" lmao

I've tried to cure this site of it's Hasan derangement syndrome before, and dogpiles tend to follow when I do, but it's important to combat misinformation about one of the genuine left figures out there