184
Marco Rubio says he is against Gaza ceasefire
(www.telegraph.co.uk)
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
this post was submitted on 14 Nov 2024
184 points (96.0% liked)
politics
19238 readers
2391 users here now
Welcome to the discussion of US Politics!
Rules:
- Post only links to articles, Title must fairly describe link contents. If your title differs from the site’s, it should only be to add context or be more descriptive. Do not post entire articles in the body or in the comments.
Links must be to the original source, not an aggregator like Google Amp, MSN, or Yahoo.
Example:
- Articles must be relevant to politics. Links must be to quality and original content. Articles should be worth reading. Clickbait, stub articles, and rehosted or stolen content are not allowed. Check your source for Reliability and Bias here.
- Be civil, No violations of TOS. It’s OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It’s NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
- No memes, trolling, or low-effort comments. Reposts, misinformation, off-topic, trolling, or offensive. Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
- Vote based on comment quality, not agreement. This community aims to foster discussion; please reward people for putting effort into articulating their viewpoint, even if you disagree with it.
- No hate speech, slurs, celebrating death, advocating violence, or abusive language. This will result in a ban. Usernames containing racist, or inappropriate slurs will be banned without warning
We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.
All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.
That's all the rules!
Civic Links
• Congressional Awards Program
• Library of Congress Legislative Resources
• U.S. House of Representatives
Partnered Communities:
• News
founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
Everyone pointing at people that didn't vote for Harris over Gaza like this is some gotcha moment are totally missing the point. If Gaza was your primary concern (like if you and your family are Palestinian perhaps) neither candidate was going to do anything for you at all. Harris paid a tiny bit of lip service to Gaza two days before the election after months of shutting down and ignoring everyone demanding ceasefire.
I voted Harris purely out of harm reduction, but she offered nothing to anyone on the left. The DNC assumes everyone that is queer or bipoc or a woman owes them their vote and then used the platform to court non-existent center right voters.
But nah, let's pretend that Harris, who took Biden's positions wholesale, would have done something different as if they weren't currently in power. Let's pretend they would have done something to restore abortion rights too, or tackle climate change or raise the minimum wage when they're so busy trying to get fascist votes and not piss off the coporate donor class.
The Democratic party needs to be rebuilt from scratch or not rebuilt at all.
Yes, yes. We get your "point". Harris's policy on Gaza was bad, so of course the clear solution was to hand the Presidency to someone who would make it worse. To send a message.
Good job, guys. Your message was loud and clear. I'm sure that in 2028, Democrats might have a slightly more pro-Palestine agenda. Maybe. Until they realize there's a hell of a lot more Jewish voters that would be even more pissed off. Lesson learned. I'm sure the people of Palestine who will lose their land, their families, and their lives between now and then will take solace in knowing that you sacrificed their lives on their behalf to send a political message in a country 5000 miles away. I'm sure that's exactly what they wanted.
Except that basically every angle except geopolitics, MIC profits, and AIPAC money, pointed towards curbing Israel/Bibi as a a good move. Even a free and independent Palestine has supermajority support - from a Nov-Oct poll of American Jewish voters:
Emphasis mine. Review the data if you care, but the continuation of Bidens policies was a huge self own. Resolve the issue and Republicans/Russian messaging of ‘Genocide Joe’ falls flat.
Those Palestinians were going to lose their land, families and lives either way. Biden has done nothing to stop Israel, neither would Harris. She made it abundantly clear that "protecting" Israel was more important than stopping genocide.
Gaza didn't cost Harris the election. Maybe Michigan, but even that's a stretch. Democrats lost ground in literally every demographic other than 100k+ income because, again, they campaigned to the right and offered absolutely nothing to the left.
If Harris told any other assumed Democratic group to fuck off this hard, nobody would be surprised they didn't vote for her. If she ran as pro-life to court Trumpers and her support from women collapsed we wouldn't be screaming about them getting in line, we'd be talking about Harris betraying those voters. This is no different, it just affects a far smaller voting bloc that people feel comfortable scapegoating.
Let's be realistic. Israel could raze Palestine any time it wants. They have the backing of the US and a vastly superior military. If Israel thought Biden and Harris would support Israel annexing the West Bank, they'd have done it over a year ago. In fact, they specifically said they're annexing the West Bank because they have Trump's backing.
If you were going to lose your land, would you rather lose your land X months or years from now, knowing you at least have a roof over your head until then and being able to hold on to the hope that maybe things might get better, or would you rather just wake up tomorrow with a giant orange bulldozer gleefully running over your house? Saying "It was going to happen anyway" is not only demonstrably false, but also doesn't mean that the solution to that problem is making it happen faster. If Israel were going to annex the west bank under a Biden administration, he'd have done it already.
Israel is currently genociding Palestinians under a Democratic president, they didn't need Trump's approval for anything. The bulldozers are already running, the people are already having their lives destroyed.
Again, I voted Harris for harm reduction, so I see your point about Harris possibly being better for Gaza in the long run, but it's not "kill my friends now" or "kill my friends later" it's "kill my friends now" or "kill my friends now and maybe, just maybe, stop sometime around the midterms when it's politically convenient and only if Harris doesn't need to keep getting the fascist vote". I don't blame Gaza voters for looking at that choice and holding out for what they really want, which is "stop killing my friends now".
Except for the instances where she moved further to the right, like on capital gains tax.
And here: https://www.politifact.com/article/2024/sep/30/kamala-harris-2024-campaign-promises-here-are-her/
You know, you should have read this before you claim Harris offered nothing to anyone on the left: https://www.politifact.com/article/2024/sep/30/kamala-harris-2024-campaign-promises-here-are-her/
Everything on that list is typical neoliberal Democrat tinkering around the edges while the world burns.
It's not that the individual ideas are bad, it's that they have no vision of a better future for most people. Where is Medicare For All? Where is tuition free college? Where is anything that isn't just a bandaid for a specific paper cut when the whole goddam country is being devoured by fascists and corporations?
That's the meat I'm talking about - something that millions of people on the left could vote for in self interest. What we got was meat for checks notes non-Medicare diabetics.