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this post was submitted on 15 Oct 2024
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Who elected you to speak on behalf of Jews?
This survey shows a majority of American Jews are Zionists. The percentage of Zionists is much higher among Jews living in Israel. That gives you a solid majority for Zionism among Jews.
Mods won’t like this post and delete it, just like the one you answered to. They might even ban me.
Let’s embrace Palestinian ultranationalist Islamist blood and soil ideology and demand ethnic cleansing of the Jews back to Europe instead.
It's also not an either/or situation. It's not either the Palestinians have the land or the Israelis have the land.
The land can be shared. So can the government. And that government can be 100% secular.
I think we can talk about it regardless of where they are. And we should talk about it. And the more people that talk about it, the closer we get to realizing it. It will, of course, take a critical mass of people in Israel to agree, but that's exactly why you keep talking about it.
That's ludicrous. You expect me to just shut my mouth about my idea of a peaceful future just because bad things are happening now? Fuck no.
Okay, so let's say this war ends, there is no more genocide, Israelis and Palestinians form a single democratic state and become a model of peace for the region- but Netanyahu and Biden are never tried for war crimes.
It sounds like that would not be acceptable to you.
If that's acceptable to you, why can't it be discussed?
Why should this topic be silenced?
Well maybe instead of criticizing random Lemmy users hoping for a better future of such cheap talk, you contact more prominent people and groups and criticize them for it instead.
I would start with the Arab Center in Washington, DC - https://arabcenterdc.org/resource/shifting-the-paradigm-the-one-state-solution-as-a-path-to-peace/
Then there's John Rees, founder of the Stop War Coalition - https://www.counterfire.org/article/palestine-the-only-solution-is-now-the-one-state-solution/
And then, of course, there's the Nelson Mandela Foundation - https://www.nelsonmandela.org/news/entry/the-time-for-action-is-now
MintPress founder and director and Palestinian journalist Mnard Adley discussed it. You'll want to get in touch with her - https://www.kcrw.com/culture/shows/scheer-intelligence/what-about-the-one-state-solution-with-an-equal-vote-for-every-palestinian-and-israeli
Let me know when you're done contacting all of them with what you're criticizing me for and I'll give you more names of people and organizations far more influential than me that you can contact over this.
The highest result for the NSDAP in elections was 43%.
Comparing Jews to Nazis is Antisemitic.
They were comparing Jews to Germans, not Nazis; they were comparing Zionists to Nazis.
Also antisemtic
No. Comparing Zionists to Nazis is not antisemitic. I am a Jew and not a Zionist. Many Zionists are Christians. Zionist does not equal Jew or vice versa.
Funny how you cite a source that doesn't even contain the word "Zionist", "Zionism", "Zion" anything.
If you actually have a look at the data you can see there's very significant chunks that don't have an issue with BDS, that don't think that Netanyahu is in any way serious about peace. Those are not the frothing-at-the-mouth Kahanites that people on the US left often mean when they say "Zionist". Yitzhak Rabin was a Zionist. Murdered by a Zionist.
It's more complicated than that and may I remind y'all that Hamas specifically targeted Hippie Kibutzim during their attack, the same kind of people who go into the West Bank during olive harvest so that settlers have a harder time shooting Palestinians, which is one of the reasons why the Israeli government doesn't give a rat's arse about the hostages.
The biggest enemies of the Zionist project, currently, is the type of people running the Israeli government. Because if you're out for a place for Jews to call home, to live in peace and prosperity, antagonising the fuck out of everyone is not the way to go about it. Traitors to the movement, the lot of them.
That survey says the opposite of what you think it does. Zionism now is essentially the Jewish version of white supremacy. It's radical. It's dangerous.
But when the survey you link to states quite clearly:
"And most Jewish adults took the position that God “did not literally give” the land of Israel to the Jewish people (42%) or said they do not believe in God or a higher power at all (24%)."
That's not Zionism as currently defined.
Zionism is independent of being religious or secular.
America and Israel. The only two countries in the world with Jews.
FACT.
Together they contain more than 80% of Jews.
I see. So based on your "evidence," 60% of the percentage of the 80% of Jews that live in America in that combined 80% total of Israel and the U.S. are "Zionists" (even though that's not what your poll said).
This is what the poll said:
"Somewhat emotionally attached to Israel" is not Zionism by any stretch of the imagination.
Emotionally attached means they want it to continue existing. That’s Zionism.
No. No it does not. I live in Indiana. I was born here. I have an emotional attachment to it.
If Canada decided to invade and turn this into Upper Ontario, because Canadian names are weird, I not only wouldn't give a shit, I'd welcome the universal healthcare.
Are you advocating for Israel to annex the West Bank so Palestinians get better healthcare?
No. And the people who claim they have an emotional attachment to Israel are not necessarily advocating for that either. A point you now seem to be intentionally missing.
Plenty of Zionists want a two state solution and for Israel to stop the occupation in the West Bank.
That isn't even relevant to the 'emotional attachment' thing. You're just bringing up irrelevancies because you want Jew to equal Israeli and vice-versa.
They’re of course not equal, but there’s a relationship.
Lots if Israelis and Zionists don’t agree with Netanyahu‘s policies.
How kind of you to finally acknowledge that after two days of "Jews support Israel and this shitty poll that doesn't prove that proves it."
Too bad you couldn't have just come in here and congratulated the Jewish members JVFP that were just arrested for this work of activism and decided to make this whole thing an attack on Jews instead.
Of course, you have yet to even acknowledge this activism despite that the fact that they STORMED THE NEW YORK STOCK EXCHANGE.
Not good enough for you to even acknowledge in a post about that activism apparently.
I never said there’s no protest or it didn’t happen. Stop making up stuff.
That is not what I said. Please re-read what I wrote:
You still have not acknowledged what they did, let alone suggested that they did a good thing.