That seems ridiculously slow. I'm not a strong biker and I could easily do that for many miles. Especially somewhere as flat as the Netherlands.
this post was submitted on 14 Jun 2026
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20 km/hr*, we don't use miles
Thank you. I was wondering what it meant
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For context, this is the place they're testing the 20km/h speed limit at. There's no reasonable explanation to go faster than 20 km/h there anyway, regardless of legal limits.
That's rather important context.
The problem would then only be if they take a test made in a specific place with narrow paths and much traffic and apply it to all bikes everywhere.
Google Maps Street View:
It looks like there's basically a longer bikeway that travels through a particularly built-up area there. The bikeway on either side of the housing area has more space on each side of the bikeway before reaching a building, so I'd expect bicyclists to use it as something of a highway, but there's no great way to route around the houses here.
There's a rail line on one side, but the other direction, there's a vaguely-parallel bikeway maybe four blocks over, so some people can probably use that.
If you want bikers to slow down then you need to do the same thing you do to cars. Traffic calming features. Because as a biker I'm going to go as fast as I'm able to safely in order to maintain my rhythm and not waste energy. Don't give me a straight path 500 meters long and expect me to putter along at running pace. That makes little sense.
Yup, speed bumps would help a bit in this regard. Or barriers that force you to slow down, like seen from top to down (bird's eye):
ROAD
--- (blank) -
ROAD
.(blank)----
ROAD
So the bike has to slow down, curve, then curve, then can speed up again. No camera's needed. Handy for intersections.
12 mph = 20 km/h or kph
A woman told the programme: βThis is all about cyclists on motorised bicycles, so I should think you would do something about motorised cyclists. Make a rule for them and not for all cyclists.β
+1
Half of the issue is that many motorised bicycles go faster than the 25 km/h they're allowed to, anyway, plus all the old people who don't have the reflexes, eyesight etc. anymore to safely control a 25 km/h vehicle on a bicycle path. It's very rare that people that go fast on regular bicycles are a serious issue.
There doesn't need to be a new rule for motorized bikes on bike lanes because there are already very clear rules. Max 25 km/h, not allowed to have autonomous support, max 250W, manufacturer has an obligation to prevent tampering.
Those rules are legislative in the whole of the EU.
The issue is with the enforcement of the rules. Not only in the streets, but also at the importer.
The issue is also with how the rules are written.
The max 250W refer to continuous motor power over 30 minutes.
Here's how that is measured to determine if a motor is legal:
- The motor has a temperature of 25+/-5Β°C at the start of the test.
- It is then supplied with the power the manufacturer says is closest to its maximum continuous power.
- The power at the crank is measured and its average must not exceed 250W during the test.
- After 30 minutes, the motor must not have warmed up by more than 20K.
So a manufacturer can have their motor tested at 250W and passed, even though it can supply 1000W peak power.
And all they need to do (legally, mind you) to supply 1000W continuously is add some cooling fins.
You are correct that the power of 250W is not very strictly defined in the standards. However, for the maximum speed there is a clear specification or 25 km/h with a maximum tolerance of 10%.
Regarding the power, yes it's true that the bike standard EN15194 allows for some creativity to boost the power (not the speed) and many ebike systems do this. However, it seems that lately this is getting out of hand with some system manufacturers offering motors with more than 1000W of peak power. This raises the question if the way the standard describes it, might be modified in the future to better align the product with the vehicle class. The whole epac vehicle class was initially meant to help people who need pedal support to cycle. The epac class was intentionally created and classified as a bike instead of a motor vehicle to promote public mobility and health. And you could make an argument that a 1000W electric bike abuses that class for a different purpose.
The movement to tighten the regulation is already underway.
And it has a good chance of succeeding, since Bosch is greasing palms to get it passed.
Of course they'll design their proposal in a way that'll also shut out their Chinese competition.
All of europe flat? I didnt think 250 would be enough help to make it up hills
I cycled up The Hill in Torino this morning. Definitely not flat, I can tell you. Strava estimates an average of 155W over 25 minutes for a leisurely 10km/h. Add another 100W and some pedaling to offset the heavier bike, and you're going up quite fast enough.
They're only capped at an average of 250W over 30 minutes.
Peak output is in the 800-1000W range, and the duration is only limited by heat.
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E-bikes are allowed to go faster than 25 km/h, it's just that the motor has to stop helping beyond that speed. Important difference.
I don't think that a general 20 km/h speed limit is the best choice. Maybe add tiers based on the type of path. Bike lanes on roads and bike paths without immediately adjacent foot paths could go pretty fast, bike paths separated from foot paths only by a line on the ground a bit slower, and shared foot/bike paths even slower. Maybe something like 30/20/15 km/h.
Before someone comments "but bike lanes on roads are also immediately adjacent to foot paths": Yes, but so are roads without bike paths and cars are allowed 30 or even 50 km/h on those. It's generally understood that roads are dangerous and need special consideration so I'd be willing to allow 30 km/h on bike lanes.
This is all about cyclists on motorised bicycles,
When I used to bike daily I would routinely hit almost 30 km/h. Today being older and wiser, I don't see why that should be allowed in city bikelanes. We have many narrow bikelanes where there is only barely room for passing, on such lanes 20 km/h absolutely sound like a good idea.
Fair, roadracers and the like can certainly get fast enough to become a nuisance. The bike lane in the article looks fairly wide, though.
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βThis is all about cyclists on motorised bicycles
I don't think so. I regularly go 25 km/h on my normal bike without trying. 35 km/h if I try. And it's not a racing bike in any way, it's a regular used 300β¬ bicycle
People like you have existed in NL for decades, it's clearly e-bikes that inspired this speed limit experiment.
E-bikes already aren't allowed to go faster than 25km/h.
They are allowed. They just may not provide electric assistance above 25. But you can drive them 30 on muscle power perfectly legally
Sure but for most e-bikes it's impractical to so so since they tend to be quite a bit heavier to pedal at that point than a regular bike.
Yes comrade chairman O7
Last year, an estimated 80,900 cyclists ended up in A&E departments after accidents, and cyclist deaths rose 14% to 281.
If you dont take into account growth of cycling over all then this number is largely meaningless. If cycling grew by 14% too then accidents didnt actually increase in a way that matters for traffic safety.
In the Netherlands the issue is, from my understanding, that people are cycling increasingly late in life.
Elderly people cycling was always a common thing. But now that e-bikes are commonplace, elderly people are able to keep cycling for much longer than they would have been able to without the assistance of an e-bike.
When an elderly person falls or otherwise gets into an accident, they are far more likely to get severly injured and/or die than when that happens to someone younger.
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What is 20mph in sane units?
What is 20mph in sane units?
Around 32 km/h.
Thanks. I misread, it's 12 mph
Iβm rarely ever going below 21 kmh average (!) on my 16km commute. Of course I am going slow where itβs necessary and dangerous and try to be as responsible as possible. Nobody wants to get hurt. But using 20 km/h speed limits beyond local hot spots would be very unrealistic given a road bike easily reaches 40+ kmh on flat terrain without a mandatory speed gauge. And the latter is also a crucial obstacle. How should speed limits be enforced when people are not forced to mow their speed? And if they are not, whatβs a number on a sign worth? I am guessing not much.
While I agree that a 20 km/h limit is too strict on a good bicycle path, no one should be doing 40 km/h on a path that's shared with people going 10-15 km/h. Where I live, most roadracers just drive on the road.
Cycling on the road is not allowed in most cases in the Netherlands, if a bike path exists. Bike paths are usually signed with a round blue sign, which means the bikepath is mandatory for all cyclists.
For once the Italians have a reasonable rule that using bike lanes is mandatory only if they are not shared with pedestrians. Now to get the them to stop walking on the separated bike paths...
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Limiting cyclists to 12mph is like forcing people to crawl. It's going to make cycling practically useless for transportation and exercise.
Seriously, I have to make a sustained conscious effort to ride under 12mph, it just feels unnatural, and I'm a fat out of shape old guy.
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Ha, that reminds me of the other day when a cyclist drove by and set off the speed camera in a 30km/h zone. Dude was zooming.
On flat terrain, 40 kmh are no problem for a road bike. Downhill, one reaches 60 without much difficulty.
Beyond the possibility of crashing, the fact that car drivers underestimate cyclistsβ speed is actually quite a danger.
I've never reached 60 downhill. 40, yes, but not 60. I think in general though, 25/30 km/hr would be more reasonable as a recommendation for bicyclists.
If downhill, there should be enough possibility to slow down, and by the next intersection, the speed should be slowed.
Thing is, in the NL, most car drivers also are bicyclists. There's also liability: in case of a crash with a bicyclist or pedestrian, the car driver is assumed 100% at fault and has to pay all damages, unless if it's proven the bicyclist/pedestrian was at fault, in which it's shared 50/50. This helps to deter car drivers from y'know, hit and runovers.
Imho additionally, cars should be designed with curves fronts, and not too tall or heavy (I'm looking at you, Dodge Compensation Rams). Those should be prohibited from driving altogether in the Netherlands. They're fucking dangerous.
I haven't been able to bike for years because of health problems but my daily commute on a bad day with uphill in both directions was over 20 km/h on my old manual iron horse refurbished with internal gears.
It would be like putting a speed limit on promenades that you can only leisurely stroll and not even do a brisk walk.
That said, I think 20km/h sounds reasonable for e-scooters.
As a Dutchman, I'm not a fan of this proposed speed limit.
My natural speed at which I comfortably cycle is around 25 km/h, which is perfectly safe if you pay attention and slow down when it is necessary in order not to hinder your fellow road users. The issue is people who cycle recklessly without keeping other cyclists in mind, in my opinion.
Enforcement is the key. And we already have reckless road usage laws.
I much prefer the Belgian method, where they set a recommended speed limit with signs of 25 km/h on the bikepath. You can cycle faster, but that's at your own risk.
Edit: E-scooters are not normally road legal on Dutch roads, so you don't see many of them.
Technically there is a path for a manufacturer to get an e-scooter tested for compliance, making them road legal. But virtually no manufacturers go through that process, making them defacto illegal (with some rare exceptions here and there)
The place where I live has a speed limit for bike streets, so entire streets that are designated for biking only, of 30 km/h. Maybe annoying to some, but if you think that 30 plus 30 equals 60 when two people approach each other, I mean that can do some serious damage. Most people I see driving bikes regularly travel only 15 km/h anyway.
Funniest thing though is, even if I drive 50 with my bike on a normal road, cars will still overtake me out of principle, even though that's exactly the posted speed limit. And speed limits apply to bikes here as well.
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