this post was submitted on 06 Jan 2026
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Satire rule (piefed.cdn.blahaj.zone)
submitted 6 days ago by SatansMaggotyCumFart@piefed.world to c/196@lemmy.world
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cross-posted from: https://piefed.blahaj.zone/c/onehundredninetysix/p/500804/satire-rule

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[–] UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world 13 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago) (2 children)

The problem with making a good movie is that you have to include characters that are relatable, typically portrayed by actors that are charming and good looking.

There's no way to get Christian Bale or Matthew McConaughey or Alec Baldwin on a screen doing a High Power Business Guy rant and not have them look cool. Hell, its hard enough to get Bill Murray or Mickey Rourke on screen doing it and not implicitly win people over.

Reduce the content of the movie to a 15-second soundbite or a two-minute long music video mash up and what you're left with is the exact same content Man-o-Sphere influencers churn out every day. Hell, as often as not, the movies are parodying the macho influencers.

The only real antidote to this kind of media is a film about women, produced/directed by women, staring proud feminist protagonists.

Same with First Wives Club, Practical Magic, Jennifer’s Body, Poor Things, Thelma and Louise, the Alien franchise, The Witch. They all had critiques of masculinity that landed harder than anything in Fight Club or Scarface, because they kept the focus on women rather than writing out these hagiographies of dysfunctional men.

Hell, 30 Rock does a great job of satirizing masculinity by keeping the focus on Liz Lemon first and foremost, rather than making it the Alec Baldwin / Tracy Morgan Show.

[–] captainlezbian@lemmy.world 2 points 6 days ago (1 children)

I agree, but at the same time I am frustrated that men aren't able to critique masculinity, even when they do it quite well, without being ignored as "cool manly man sacrifices himself to avoid bothering his loved ones".

Like it or not the people who need to hear these critiques the most want to hear them from men and see how masculinity is hurting the men themselves.

[–] UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world 1 points 6 days ago

people who need to hear these critiques the most want to hear them from men

They want to hear them from men because they want to recharacterize a popular movie as a Manly Movie.

That's the reason they need to hear the critiques from women.

[–] Skullgrid@lemmy.world 2 points 6 days ago (1 children)

the Alien franchise had critiques of masculinity

???

I thought the idea/feminism in alien is more "fucking aliens, this is a horrid, impossible situation. Ridley can do it though 💪

[–] UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world 7 points 6 days ago (1 children)

Ripley was the character. Ridley was the director. 😜

Across the series, Ripley embodies maternal instincts while her companions typically fall victim to obsessive curiosity, bravado, and ruthlessness. Subsequent non-Ripley iterations replicate this pattern, with the more selfless and nurturing characters outlasting the individualists and machos. She's got her big scenes, but they tend to be when she's backed into a corner, not when she's trying to show off or get rich quick.

[–] Skullgrid@lemmy.world 2 points 6 days ago (1 children)

Ripley embodies maternal instincts while her companions typically fall victim to obsessive curiosity, bravado, and ruthlessness.

EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeh...

There are... "feminine" ideas in alien, and I admittedly haven't seen it in ages, but it's hardly an explicitly "about women, produced/directed by women, staring proud feminist protagonists." type of film. Ripley is the person on the ship that understands what the fuck is up, and behaves intelligently while everyone else (including the robot) gets slaughtered. But that's mostly the horror trappings, rather than her being an explicit proud feminist protagonist. She ends up as a feminist icon, absolutely, but she's a competent person who reacts correctly to the situation. It's not "us gals against the world, fuck these butch guys". Also, the more explicit message is "fuck the Weyland-Yutani Corporation and inhumane capitalism"... also "follow workplace safety protocols, always wear PPE when dealing with non-earth planets and alien fauna"

[–] UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world 5 points 6 days ago (1 children)

it’s hardly an explicitly “about women, produced/directed by women, staring proud feminist protagonists.”

No. It's largely an indictment of capitalist colonialism, ecological degradation, and space exploration as a means of loud throat clearing sound alienation of the working class.

But that’s mostly the horror trappings, rather than her being an explicit proud feminist protagonist.

Her "final girl" status is definitely a horror trope. But her path to survival is rooted in her compassion and comradery. This sets her apart from the male cast, who embody a more traditional masculine frontier stereotype that ironically fail to serve them on The Final Frontier.

also “follow workplace safety protocols, always wear PPE when dealing with non-earth planets and alien fauna”

Going in cowboy style reflected a 70s/80s attitude of masculine indifference towards personal safety.

[–] Skullgrid@lemmy.world 1 points 6 days ago (1 children)

Her “final girl” status is definitely a horror trope. But her path to survival is rooted in her compassion and comradery. This sets her apart from the male cast, who embody a more traditional masculine frontier stereotype that ironically fail to serve them on The Final Frontier.

From wiki, since , again, I haven't watch alien in forever.

spoilerThe remaining crew decide to initiate the self-destruct sequence and escape in the shuttle, but the alien kills Parker and Lambert as they gather supplies. Now alone, Ripley starts the sequence but the alien blocks her path to the shuttle. After trying unsuccessfully to abort the self-destruct, she reaches the shuttle with Jones and launches it before the Nostromo explodes.

Now, this shows there's 1) another woman who also dies, and 2) another man in the same situation as the women.

Part of this that I find kinda annoying is that we're basing these things off "traditional assignments" on what "masculinity" and "femininity" are, which as we are finding out (and have been finding out through feminism) is fucking bullshit. Men and women embody various roles and archetypes, and have done forever.

[–] UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world 2 points 6 days ago (1 children)

we’re basing these things off “traditional assignments” on what “masculinity” and “femininity”

It's a movie released in 1979, during the thick of Third Wave Feminism. You're going to get some tropes. But it helps to remember a core conceit of "Alien" as a movie is "What if a man could get pregnant?" Presenting tropes and subverting them is part of the appeal of the franchise.

Men and women embody various roles and archetypes, and have done forever.

Movies tend to boil down the human experience for entertaining consumption. That's another reason why "We're writing a male oriented satire about toxic masculinity" stumbles over its own dick. At some point, you're only going to have so many characters and perspectives and a limited amount of time for each of them. You're going to get caricatures whether you want them or not. You have to if you want your film to be watchable.

[–] Skullgrid@lemmy.world 2 points 6 days ago

But it helps to remember a core conceit of “Alien” as a movie is “What if a man could get pregnant?” Presenting tropes and subverting them is part of the appeal of the franchise.

true dat.

You’re going to get caricatures whether you want them or not. You have to if you want your film to be watchable.

Whether or not this is true, it's sad.