this post was submitted on 22 Mar 2025
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Wales’s 20mph speed limit has cut road deaths. Why is there still even a debate? (www.theguardian.com)
submitted 2 days ago by DrunkEngineer@lemmy.world to c/fuckcars@lemmy.world
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cross-posted from: https://feddit.uk/post/26116694

Even with the caveats about limited data and untangling causation and correlation, the statistics are striking: the first year of a scheme in Wales where the speed limit on urban roads was lowered to 20mph resulted in about 100 fewer people killed or seriously injured.

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[–] BenM2023@lemmy.world 20 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

Live in Wales so I have skin in this game...

Observations: 20mph limit means most people drive below 30 in urban areas.

20mph might not be universal in UK but many many places I drive through over the border in Engerland have a 20 limit.

Most roads with a 20 limit have an average speed of... Stationary /walking pace anyway.

The mandatory 20 limit was proposed and supported by Welsh right of centre politicos who dropped it like a hot potato on implementation - it was was weaponised legislation used as a stick with which to beat the left of centre Welsh Government Assembly ruling party.

My commute of 16 miles each way, though mainly through urban areas, has about 500m of 20mph limit.... Commute time is unaffected. I'm all right Jack!

Over all I like the 20mph limit and the shouty loudmouths who don't have failed to engage critical thinking.

[–] Swarfega@lemm.ee 53 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (4 children)

My small town has just moved to 20 mph and boy it feels slow in a car. However it's just so much better when I'm on the bike or needing to cross the road. Where I walk my dog I need to cross the road on a bend in the road so cars come quickly. I'll often run across that section of road because it's dangerous. Since the change it's now no longer a problem.

I love it on my road bike. It makes a change for cars to be holding me up. I'm waiting for the day when some driver moans at me for going faster than 20 mph.

It's definitely calmer. I'm all for it!

[–] flippinfreebird@lemmy.today 20 points 2 days ago

After watching the Not Just Bikes video on speed limits, I decided to drive only 20 mph through the neighborhood. I really like it. I can actually appreciate people's landscaping. I can wave at people being outside. I can notice far more details all about. Most importantly, I can stop almost immediately if needed. I can't care less about anyone driving behind me, because nowhere in my suburban city is worth getting to in a hurry.

[–] massive_bereavement@fedia.io 11 points 2 days ago

I'm all in if this means there's a public transportation option that goes faster than that, so I'll only use my car if I must, but knowing there's always a quicker way.

[–] Ste41th@lemmy.ml 3 points 2 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago)

I believe all road users are bound to the same rules so if you are on a road bike you technically have to follow the speed limit, and if there is any traffic lights you also have to obey them.

Correction: cyclists arn't obliged to follow the speed limit however they do have to obey traffic signs and traffic lights and also remain in the centre of the lane unless it’s safe to move to the left to enable a car to overtake.

The closest thing to speeding a cyclist can be charged with in the uk is “cycling furiously” or “wanton and furious cycling.”

[–] griff@lemmings.world -2 points 2 days ago

Car = Conveyance of Aggressive Reality

[–] Donkter@lemmy.world 24 points 2 days ago (1 children)

Well we don't have large sea mammals that roam our streets here in America so it's never been a huge issue. I mean 20 mph seems excessive really considering their size.

[–] scholar@lemmy.world 10 points 2 days ago

They're big, but the number of unsuspecting drivers making a wrong turn and driving into Wales is shocking...

[–] griff@lemmings.world 17 points 2 days ago

Slow down the motor vehicles, make streets & sidewalks safer for actual humans who are out & about on foot, on wheels & so forth

[–] Cypher@lemmy.world 4 points 2 days ago (2 children)

an estimated 10 fewer deaths and a nearly one-third drop in overall casualties

Nothing like misrepresenting statistics to really sway people.

[–] technocrit@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

The article says both:

the first year of a scheme in Wales where the speed limit on urban roads was lowered to 20mph resulted in about 100 fewer people killed or seriously injured.

and then later...

While Welsh government statisticians warn that at least three years’ data will be needed for a meaningful conclusion, the road casualty figures – showing an estimated 10 fewer deaths and a nearly one-third drop in overall casualties – follow research from insurers indicating that 20mph zones appear to be bringing down the number of claims.

There's a citation for the first number 100 but the citation for the second number doesn't say anything about 10 people.

So it seems like 100 might be the more accurate number. I wouldn't blame OP. Sloppy article.

[–] AdamEatsAss@lemmy.world 2 points 2 days ago (1 children)

What is misrepresented?

[–] technocrit@lemmy.dbzer0.com 0 points 1 day ago

See my reply for what I think they're talking about. 100 vs 10 in article.

[–] MemmingenFan923@feddit.org 5 points 2 days ago (1 children)

But it's my right and... freedom yadda yadda

[–] Evkob@lemmy.ca 6 points 2 days ago

I thought they drove on the left in Wales?