this post was submitted on 18 Mar 2025
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[–] girlthing@lemmy.blahaj.zone 9 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

Good! In a culture that worships cops and "thought leaders", this is two steps up from meekly accepting whatever powerful people say.

Now it's time for:
(3) Acting on your ethical convictions towards specific goals, and learning to work with people who share them, even when their motivations or values are different.

P.S. As others here have stated, (1) and (2) are not contradictory. If morality is constructed, then we all construct our own. Unless you actually WANT to be an amoral bastard.

[–] FauxLiving@lemmy.world 9 points 1 week ago

viewing disagreement as moral monstrosity

This should be the slogan of public social media.

[–] HawlSera@lemm.ee 8 points 1 week ago (1 children)

I believe the only objective morality is that you must act without intent to harm others unless it is in self-defense.

[–] Apytele@sh.itjust.works 8 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (2 children)

How far in advance are you allowed to act in self defense? If you all but know they're leaving the room to go get a gun out of the next room can you strike while their back is turned as they leave? What if it's the neighbor who thinks you banged his wife and he's going next door to get the gun? For most people there's probably a distance at which the answer becomes "call the cops" but that distance probably gets a lot farther if the guy you think is about to shoot you is the sheriff's brother. And what if you're less sure? What if the person is clearly unhinged but it feels like a coinflip as to whether or not they're about to try to murder you?

What about on a wider societal level? If you think a group of people is marshalling to attack you or the wider society can you attack first? Do you arrest them or even have the police violently disrupt their gatherings? Do you become a terrorist and commit an act of mass violence in the hopes that it will prevent them from attacking you or another group you consider vulnerable?

That raises the other question of whether it's acceptable to defend others, but for the sake of simplicity it sounds like you're not in favor of getting in the middle of other people's fights which is fair, but do your kids fights count as your fights? Is there an age limit on that?

None of those questions necessarily apply to any particular ideology but I can think of a few ways people might and often actually have used these concepts in ways both favoring and disfavoring my own personal convictions.

[–] cows_are_underrated@feddit.org 5 points 1 week ago (1 children)

And now you successfully turned a simple statement into one hell of a philophical exam.

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[–] Initiateofthevoid@lemmy.dbzer0.com 8 points 1 week ago (2 children)

This is basically how teaching secular ethics always is, though. Doesn't seem special about 2025. People will always be overconfident in their beliefs, but it's not necessarily a coincidence or even hypocrisy that they can hold both views at the same time.

You can believe that morality is a social construct while simultaneously advocating for society to construct better morals. Morality can be relative and opposing views on morality can still be perceived as monstrous relative to the audience's morality.

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[–] finitebanjo@lemmy.world 7 points 1 week ago (9 children)

Is he saying the first point is wrong or just that it conflicts with the second?

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[–] Batman@lemmy.world 6 points 1 week ago

Everything in moderating or something. I'm not an ear doctor

[–] MehBlah@lemmy.world 5 points 1 week ago

Now that is funny. Its funny because its true.

[–] Triasha@lemmy.world 5 points 1 week ago

Subjective morality is self evidently true, but that gives us no information about how to live our lives, so we must live as if absolute morality is true.

We only have our own perspective. Someone else's subjective morality is meaningless to us, we aren't them.

[–] fishos@lemmy.world 5 points 1 week ago (2 children)

For the people not getting it:

  1. They treat morals as opinions.

  2. They also treat their personal opinions like they're the absolute best opinion.

Another way:

They think everyone likes different ice cream flavors and that's fine. They like Rocky Road flavor. They also think anyone who doesn't is a monster.

Convictions are one thing. But they need to be logically consistent. Saying morality is subjective but you're evil if you don't subscribe to my personal version is illogical.

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