Not only did we squarely place ourselves on the path of economic/social decline for the foreseeable future, but we also just guaranteed that Trump will not be held accountable for his crimes.
We have utterly failed as citizens in a democratic society.
Buckle up. It gets much, much worse from here.
You need to stop thinking laws are inviolable writ handed down from God. We're all playing a game of shared make believe where the rules are only strong as the collective will to enforce them. That will doesn't appear to be sufficient so he can likely do what he wants.
This is the answer. Clear, concise, and correct,
Trump and his party are nazis. Nazis suck because they bring the law of the jungle into civilization.
The law of civilization is cooperation.
The law of the jungle is, can I physically do it.
Republicans basically exist to shout, burn their own house down (also yours), and celebrate. They're going to burn the checks and balances.
Bruh it won't matter.
Right? Who is gonna stop him from doing whatever the fuck he wants?
Somebody with better aim. I very much doubt we've seen the last attempt on his life. Groups on all sides are inching closer and closer to extremist acts lately, and don't show any signs of slowing down. We're in for chaos now.
I very much doubt we've seen the last attempt on his life.
And it's just as likely to come from a disillusioned historically republican as from someone more to the left.
nice username
The American Constitution will stop him doing a lot of things people are scared of.
No it won't.
The poster above had it right. The law only works if the will of the people make it work. Same applies to the Constitution.
Public schools in the bible belt have been teaching creationism and putting the ten commandments in their classrooms. Do you think the New Order we just elected are going to go out of their way to enforce the Constitution and make them stop doing things like that?
Be prepared for FLAGRANT violations of the Constitution in the coming years. I mean come on, the guy we just elected illegally attempted to overturn the last election and is a convicted felon.
It's over. America lost.
The American Constitution says that Presidents can't accept gifts from any foreign source, and that has been interpreted in the past as a general prohibition on Presidents operating in any capacity in any private enterprise. Jimmy Carter put his peanut farm in a blind trust.
Not only was Donald Trump allowed to circumvent this during his first term, retaining ownership of his businesses and nominally putting his kids in charge while they pursued foreign deals, but today Trump is waist deep in Crypto, and owns a majority share of a publicly traded company whose ticker is his initials. Foreigners can (and likely do) shovel money into both. Do you think anyone will ask him to divest, like the Constitution requires him to?
The Constitution is useless unless it is enforced. It relies on checks and balances between competing branches, and right now they are broken. The only checks on Presidential power are the military (whose oath is to yhe Constitution, not to any one President) and the individual states (who retain all powers not explicitly given to the Federal government).
No president has tried it before. Whether he can get away with pardoning himself has yet to be seen. For him not to get away with it would require someone to bring some sort of court case challenging it. And to bring a case, they have to have "standing." (That is to say, they have to have some credible justification why the self-pardoning action the president took wronged the petitioner in some way.) Which would probably require some legal argument that has never been made before.
I'm guessing Trump probably could get away with it, but given that no president has tried this, we'll just have to see for sure.
he doesn't need to since he already has absolute legal immunity according to the Supreme Court.
The president is now absolutely immune from all legal prosecution as long as it pertains to a "official duty".
The constitution is vague enough about official presidential duties that the official duties of the president can literally be anything.
Trump, and future presidents, are functionally immune from any legal consequences for any actions they take.
At least certain courts may interpret "official duty" differently...
doesn't really matter while the Supreme Court has a conservative majority, unfortunately.
Yup. As long as the Supreme Court is controlled by an ultra-conservative majority it's game over. They ultimately decide America's trajectory. And this election basically cemented that majority for the rest of our lives.
We just placed ourselves on the worst timeline.
definitely sucks right now, but this could spur Supreme Court reform or election reform, Trump could get convicted or impeached on one of the many cases he has coming up, he could die, he could fully go dementia, you'd have Vance, but he does not have the same selfish appeal that dumps does.
The US might be lost, but I doubt it.
I don't think this is the worst timeline. there are way worse timelines.
in one timeline that Russian sergeant or whatever didn't stop his commanding submarine officer from shooting a nuke in retaliation from a false radar reading and starting World War III to 50 years ago.
and then another Russian co-pilot didn't stop his co-pilot from shooting a nuke in retaliation from a false radar reading The captured some geese.
I mean that's two times we got pretty big reprieves in this timeline.
definitely sucks right now, but this could spur Supreme Court reform or election reform
Even under the best circumstances reforming the SC would be extremely unlikely because it would require a super majority. Same with election reform. Our government, in its entirety, will now be run by extremists who literally ran on deconstructing our government and replacing it with something in their image. The way our government has worked our entire lives is likely over.
Trump could get convicted or impeached on one of the many cases he has coming up
Trump is effectively king now. SC made him immune to any and all prosecution while president. Laws only work if the will of the people make them work. The majority of Americans just crowned a king. They aren't going to make those laws work. You will not see justice for Trump's crimes now. That possibility is gone.
he could die, he could fully go dementia,
Doesn't matter. He will be replaced and nothing about this timeline will change.
I don’t think this is the worst timeline. there are way worse timelines.
I mean, obviously. But considering the two timelines we had an option to be on, we chose the worst. And it's going to be very, very bad for average Americans.
"Even under the best circumstances reforming the SC would be extremely unlikely"
No, under the best circumstances it would be extremely likely.
Roberts, Thomas et al would keel over from heart attacks, Trump would have an attack of conscience and elect compassionate, wise judges.
or Hakeem Jeffr ies is persuasive than Trump and everyone commits to Court reform.
"now be run by extremists who literally ran on deconstructing our government and replacing it with something in their image."
they'll certainly try.
there's just too much historical evidence going against your theory of defeatist inevitability/futility.
"The way our government has worked our entire lives is likely over."
this has happened uncountable times throughout just US history, but especially recently when the president was afforded absolutely legal immunity.
I'd say that decision was more ultimately significant than Trump being elected.
"SC made him immune to any and all prosecution while president"
many of dumps past, current and upcoming cases definitively do not have to do with his presidency and occurred outside of his presidency completely.
"Laws only work if the will of the people make them work."
not really. Trump didn't get fined $100 million and lose two court cases solely because of the will of the people.
he went to court because of the legal system, and he lost those legal battles three times recently.
"The majority of Americans just crowned a king."
a chubsy jester, but sure.
"You will not see justice for Trump's crimes now. That possibility is gone."
already seen it a few times, probably going to see it again.
"Doesn't matter. He will be replaced and nothing about this timeline will change."
this is ridiculous and has zero evidence to support it.
dumps is the zealot catalyst here, the person in the seat pretending to fellate and stroke microphones is very important.
If you don't understand that, then your entire realistic perspective is foundationally flawed.
"I mean, obviously."
that this is not the worst timeline was obvious to me.
you claimed the literal opposite statement, that this was in fact the worst timeline, in the previous comment.
"But considering the two timelines we had an option to be on..."
you believe in timelines, but you believe there are only two at any specific moment?
bullet 2 inches left
Hilary doesn't steal Sanders' nomination.
5/4 decisions go four-five.
expand your mind.
"it's going to be very, very bad for average Americans."
oh yeah. almost all Americans. but you know they voted for it so...
blocking the bike path for everyone else, too.
Yes, because he can do anything he wants and just declare legal.
There is no punishment for this supervillain. His cult makes sure of that.
Yes. Constitutionally, the threat of impeachment is supposed to prevent that.
The Constitutional text is very broad:
The President ... shall have Power to grant Reprieves and Pardons for Offences against the United States, except in Cases of Impeachment.
So it looks rather absolute, for Fedral crimes. However, the real situation is complicated. This is just one clause in the Constitution, while the President is supposed to be bound by all of it. So, presumably, he can't exercise his pardon power in a way that violates something else in the Constitution. If you go deeper into the Federalist papers, it's quite clear that the Founders held that no man should be his own judge, and a self-pardon effectively does just that.
Here is a good write-up, although I do note it was written before the Supreme Court put their thumb on the scale and said he could do whatever the hell he wanted, as long as he doesn't get impeached for it:
https://protectdemocracy.org/work/the-presidential-pardon-power-explained/
I expect him to do it anyway. It will be challenged, but courts will reject it due to "lack of standing" and sidestep the messy business of having to tell the King he went too far.
I don't think so.
But if it's like any other norm-breaking violation we've seen him make, he will do it anyway, there will be legal challenges, they will ultimately be fruitless, he will suffer no consequences, and everyone will go along with it.
For federal stuff, yes ... probably, it's never been tested, but the current SCOTUS won't stop him.
Not for state crimes. Like the 34 felony counts in NY. But enforcement of any sentence (probably financial) is unclear. Also unprecedented.
I know nothing about anything related to the USA but I predict that Trump will not pay anything
I'd like to see a Constitutional Crisis, please
When he controls the Supreme Court... yes. He can pardon anyone for anything.
Prepare to see everyone involved in the most blatant act of open tyranny since the Civil War pardoned as soon as he takes office.
Yup. The Confederacy won this time. Prepare yourself for a bleak future.
Not state level offenses, only federal crimes, at least as the law stands now.
Theoretically, probably not, practically, and in real life, most probably definitely yes.
Dude, the guy is going to pardon everything and anyone. He's going to make the justice a complete joke.
Just like he did in his first term.
Well, he pardoned the people he liked that kissed his ass.
He can't pardon himself of state charges, only federal, at least for now.
yes
Don't know, but we're gonna find out. Exciting times. Oh, and get ready to pay 3x as much for your internet access, and to have all torrent sites nuked from orbit.
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