494
submitted 11 months ago by MicroWave@lemmy.world to c/news@lemmy.world

These countries tried everything from cash to patriotic calls to duty to reverse drastically declining birth rates. It didn’t work.

If history is any guide, none of this will work: No matter what governments do to convince them to procreate, people around the world are having fewer and fewer kids.

In the US, the birth rate has been falling since the Great Recession, dropping almost 23 percent between 2007 and 2022. Today, the average American woman has about 1.6 children, down from three in 1950, and significantly below the “replacement rate” of 2.1 children needed to sustain a stable population. In Italy, 12 people now die for every seven babies born. In South Korea, the birth rate is down to 0.81 children per woman. In China, after decades of a strictly enforced one-child policy, the population is shrinking for the first time since the 1960s. In Taiwan, the birth rate stands at 0.87.

you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[-] Croquette@sh.itjust.works 8 points 11 months ago

You don't need to penalize the non-parents to entice people to have kids.

But it needs incredible systemic change to do that. The first one would be climate change policies and programs that will at the minimum stop the current trajectory we are in, and at best reverse it.

Second, we need to reign in the extremely greedy corps and make them pay their fair share. In a not so distant past, when the economy wasn't doing well, companies would cut their profits before raising prices. Today, this is practically unheard of. The margins must be kept at all cost, the rest be damned.

Third, create decent safety nets. Right now, our social policies are eroding pretty much everywhere. Some countries more than the others.

Then, we can start thinking about policies that favor the patents.

We have enough resources and technologies to solve all of our problems, but since society is lead by greedy conmans in the pocket of corporations, until that changes, people won't be comfortable having kids.

[-] merc@sh.itjust.works 0 points 11 months ago

You don’t need to penalize the non-parents to entice people to have kids.

Maybe, maybe not. In the past there were enough people who wanted to have kids that if you just made it easy, they'd do it. But, it could be that the modern world is different enough that you really do need to incentivize people to become parents and even punish them if they don't. Especially in a place like South Korea, it sounds like it's going to be very hard to convince anybody that they should become parents.

the extremely greedy corps

Extremely greedy corps are run by people, and their profits flow to people. It's really not about corporations, it's about people.

society is lead by greedy conmans in the pocket of corporations

Society is led by rich people who own corporations or massive amounts of shares in corporations. Again, corporations aren't the problem, it's people.

[-] Croquette@sh.itjust.works 3 points 11 months ago

The current system is controlled by a handful of people. The vast majority of the people only try to survive in the current system. It is extremely hard to take a risk and go against the grain because if you fail against people with lots of resources, you are destitute.

It is not the person on the floor that tries to survive that is responsible for the decision of the corporation and ultimately the damage that it does. It's easy to say that they should stick to their convictions, but the threat of starvation and homelessness is an extremely dissuasive.

So I disagree, corporations are the problem because they cannot be separated from the handful of C-suites controlling them.

[-] merc@sh.itjust.works 1 points 11 months ago

Corporations are largely controlled by their shareholders. In many cases, Blackrock, State Street or Vanguard control those shares on behalf of their investors. They're the ones who control who is on the boards, and the boards control who is in the C-suites.

The reason that so many corporations focus on maximizing profits over everything else is that it's what's demanded by the boards, who are appointed by the shareholders, who are largely represented by Blackrock, State Street and Vanguard. Any human impulse to have a company care about the environment or about its employees is basically nullified by this process where the institutional investors only want the key numbers to go up. In some cases the shares are owned by pension funds who represent teachers who care a lot about the world, enough that they take a relatively low paying job that requires a lot of work. But, those teachers want to be able to retire some day, and so they want their pensions to grow big, so they want the companies in those pensions to make profits. By the time an individual kindergarten teacher's desires filter up from herself to her union to her pension to the institutional investor to the board to the CEO, the only message that gets through is "more profits". Alongside those teachers are a lot of very rich people who treat money like a high score, and just want the number to go up.

It's true that a lot of people in C-suites lack empathy. But, they're kept in place by boards who are appointed by huge institutional investment firms who represent shareholders who care only about profit. But, also, the current system doesn't really allow for messages other than "more profits" to filter through to these companies.

The corporation isn't a sentient creature, it's just a group of people, and those people respond to the stimulus that comes from their owners. The only real message getting through is "more profits", so that's the focus of the corporations.

[-] Iamdanno@lemmy.world 2 points 11 months ago

If they are publically-traded, they have a fiduciary responsibility to the shareholders to "maximize profit". They have no responsibility to "make the world a better place".

That's (only one reason) why corporations suck.

this post was submitted on 28 Nov 2023
494 points (97.0% liked)

News

23310 readers
3443 users here now

Welcome to the News community!

Rules:

1. Be civil


Attack the argument, not the person. No racism/sexism/bigotry. Good faith argumentation only. This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban. Do not respond to rule-breaking content; report it and move on.


2. All posts should contain a source (url) that is as reliable and unbiased as possible and must only contain one link.


Obvious right or left wing sources will be removed at the mods discretion. We have an actively updated blocklist, which you can see here: https://lemmy.world/post/2246130 if you feel like any website is missing, contact the mods. Supporting links can be added in comments or posted seperately but not to the post body.


3. No bots, spam or self-promotion.


Only approved bots, which follow the guidelines for bots set by the instance, are allowed.


4. Post titles should be the same as the article used as source.


Posts which titles don’t match the source won’t be removed, but the autoMod will notify you, and if your title misrepresents the original article, the post will be deleted. If the site changed their headline, the bot might still contact you, just ignore it, we won’t delete your post.


5. Only recent news is allowed.


Posts must be news from the most recent 30 days.


6. All posts must be news articles.


No opinion pieces, Listicles, editorials or celebrity gossip is allowed. All posts will be judged on a case-by-case basis.


7. No duplicate posts.


If a source you used was already posted by someone else, the autoMod will leave a message. Please remove your post if the autoMod is correct. If the post that matches your post is very old, we refer you to rule 5.


8. Misinformation is prohibited.


Misinformation / propaganda is strictly prohibited. Any comment or post containing or linking to misinformation will be removed. If you feel that your post has been removed in error, credible sources must be provided.


9. No link shorteners.


The auto mod will contact you if a link shortener is detected, please delete your post if they are right.


10. Don't copy entire article in your post body


For copyright reasons, you are not allowed to copy an entire article into your post body. This is an instance wide rule, that is strictly enforced in this community.

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS