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Do most Brits still think chav was/is an actual subculture? (lemmy.world)

submitted 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago) by TinyLittlePuni@lemmy.world to c/askuk@feddit.uk

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I remember an assignment we had was reading Chavs by Owen Jones, and based on that book it seems like sociologists agree that chav was never a subculture, it was the upper classes taking ordinary working class young people fashion and turned it into a made up, monstrous delinquent subculture to paint the working class people as bad or something. Owen Jones said it was not a subculture and nobody unironically identified as a chav. It was purely a classist insult.

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[–] heliotrope@retrofed.com 4 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago) (1 children)

Please get a life. If you're a chav/ned/roadman, we honestly don't care; nor do we give a fuck if you like them.

I, a member of the working class from the north-east, have both close friends and sworn enemies across this demographic. Do I want to be a part of it myself? Not really. Do I care if other people do/are? Also no. You do you.

Alternatively, if this is a hyperfixation, there are friendlier ways to approach it than accusing the Fediverse of classism.

[–] TinyLittlePuni@lemmy.world 0 points 5 days ago (1 children)

What demographic? As I said, it's not a subculture. It's a caricature to mock the working class.

[–] heliotrope@retrofed.com 1 points 5 days ago (1 children)

If it's a caricature then how have I met so many of them?

[–] TinyLittlePuni@lemmy.world 0 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago) (1 children)

You mean normal guys in tracksuits/sportswear. That's just the default working class/council estate fashion.

[–] heliotrope@retrofed.com 2 points 5 days ago (1 children)

I do not. What I am talking about is people (women included) who are generally loud, boisterous, admittedly a little threatening (though this stems from my past experiences), and who act with little to no regard for the feelings or wellbeing of anyone other than themselves. These aren't hard and fast rules, of course.

When I see roadmen around the city I now live in, they're never causing any trouble: just hanging around, usually vaping, and that's okay. The idea that everyone matching this description is a violent criminal is bullshit drummed up by the tabloids in order to scare old folk and distance them from young people. However, when I was in middle/high school, any dickhead who decided to be cruel to me or my brother for any reason would match this description every time — with the exceptions of two specific boys, who were posh twats. At the same time, many of my friends then and now either fit this description or have the lifestyle usually attributed to the stereotype.

The clothing is just a correlation.

[–] TinyLittlePuni@lemmy.world 1 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago) (1 children)

Those just sound like idiots who happen to dress in mainstream working class fashion trends. Not members of a subculture.

[–] heliotrope@retrofed.com 1 points 5 days ago (1 children)

Did I say anything about a subculture?

[–] TinyLittlePuni@lemmy.world 1 points 5 days ago (1 children)

The title of the post is "Do most Brits still think chav was/is an actual subculture?"

[–] heliotrope@retrofed.com 1 points 5 days ago

Ah, but the conversation has moved past your initial question.