156

Businesses are in it for the money, employees tend to be one of the larger expenses, so maintaining some bullshit positions that would cost them money doesn't make fiscal sense, so what's up?

you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
[-] Nollij@sopuli.xyz 10 points 1 year ago

Can you clarify what, specifically, you mean by bullshit jobs?

For instance, I've seen some recent discussions about (mostly IT) jobs where you can do nothing almost all the time. These exist because every once in a while, they are REALLY important. There's also a lot of mystery about what's involved, usually from automation changing the workload.

[-] Nibodhika@lemmy.world 11 points 1 year ago

Also non-technical people need to understand that automation makes life easier, but you still need someone who knows how to do it manually to fix the automation in case it breaks or needs updating. That person will do mostly nothing most of the time, but if you didn't had him full time he would be extremely expensive to hire on demand on a rush, since he could ask whatever price he wanted and you would have to pay it.

[-] ParkingPsychology@kbin.social 5 points 1 year ago

It's not just that the person would be expensive. Systems like that require system specific knowledge. So it's possible that it would take an outsider 3 months of study to get to the point where they can fix an issue properly in 5 minutes.

You can't make a baby in 1 month with 9 mothers. Some tasks just have an upfront cost and SOME IT automation jobs are like that.

And yes, you can try and do bodge job after bodge job "just to keep it going". And that works for some time. But eventually the small mistakes end up causing large outages. And then you need someone that can piece together how the small issues cause big outages.

[-] meco03211@lemmy.world 5 points 1 year ago

Superiors not understanding what the job entails helps. Superior says do task A. Old guy not too computer savvy takes a long time to do task A. Of guy retires and a new young girl gets the role. Superior says do task A. New young girl does it in a few minutes and has extra time. I've run into that a lot.

[-] Valmond@lemmy.mindoki.com 2 points 1 year ago

Or the exact opposite, not trying to contradict you here, but I have seen lots of jobs that had to be just stopped (the job itself, not the person doing it) just because the knowledge went away with parting people.

[-] meco03211@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago

That could go either way. Had a job where a guy retired and they suddenly found out no one knew what he did but it needed to be done. There were legit conversations about offering the retired guy contract work just to teach someone what he did. In that case the manager had the bullshit job that could have been eliminated.

[-] ratman150@sh.itjust.works 6 points 1 year ago

I do one of those "IT jobs that you do nothing until you do everything" it's kinda wild and I have to remember not to completely fuck off and at least pretend to do something work related.

I say as I'm responding to this on company time.

[-] ALostInquirer@lemm.ee 4 points 1 year ago

So, what comes to mind when I write bullshit jobs are jobs simply for the sake of jobs, like to say that a business is in fact hiring for some unclear reason, or because of some cultural inertia that insists people must be working so they just make up jobs.

A more realistic form would be the weird busywork kind of jobs that seemingly could be automated but just...Aren't...For some reason, but these may be more like what you describe where it's not exactly bullshit yet it can feel very close to it at times.

[-] meco03211@lemmy.world 5 points 1 year ago

Sometimes those jobs that can be automated are already. At a previous job a coworker had been asked to prep a weekly report. When he took it on, this would take him half a day. I wanted to work on some excel macro skills so I worked with him to figure out what was needed. Wrote an ugly ass macro that worked for what was needed. I told him in no uncertain terms he should not tell anyone about the time savings. He should use it as he sees fit.

Same job different person. HR business partner called me into her office. Had an excel file open. Ultimately what they were asking was for a simple formatting issue. I'm talking like merge and center or using the format painter. A couple times. It took her longer to explain what she needed than it took to "fix" it. She exclaimed that it probably would have taken her hours to figure that out... there were also salaries on the spreadsheet...

[-] Nollij@sopuli.xyz 2 points 1 year ago

Jobs that exist exclusively for the sake of jobs really only exist in places of government (or caused by government). Otherwise, as you mentioned, the profit motive would kick in.

But what you're mainly describing here is something different - it's jobs that exist because someone (possibly many people) are bad at their job. Those unclear job openings? Often, it's because Bob is leaving, and we need someone to replace him. But no one really knows what Bob does, or how to find another Bob, or even what would happen if they didn't have a Bob. Or a PHB gets lofty ideas about what Bob's replacement should do better, with no connection to reality. Or HR interferes with what the engineers say they actually need, and how to screen for that.

The people that can literally be replaced by an Excel macro? Their work is valuable, and often something the business needs. It was probably done on paper a long time ago. At some point it got moved onto a computer, and a process was developed. This person has probably been doing it reliably for 20 years. No one wants to mess with it. Or a really big one, the corporate bureaucracy has stopped everyone that's tried to make it better.

I can attest that I've repeatedly been put on bullshit busywork projects because of managers that were completely detached from reality. Sure, they may sound cool, but it's immediately obvious to anyone else that it will never actually be used. Or they themselves want to check a box on their own review with higher managers to say they accomplished something, even if they really didn't.

[-] Lemmylaugh@lemmy.ml 1 points 1 year ago

You mean like manual work that can be automated?

I'll say this, as an engineer who's worked closely with the brass tacks, a lot of the time when new directors or c level people are brought in, they want to own a space. There was a solution existing prior to them, because the company already existed before they joined. But no one wants to be the guy who supports the previous ideas (maintenance on an engine isn't as sexy as designing it) because the idea doesn't have their branding. They want to be seen as bold/innovative, etc. So they make some calls and they find a solution that promises everything they have and more. If the new solution is a success, their position is cemented, they are now a stakeholder in the company. Sales guy is going to sell his ass off, maybe the workforce has to be repurposed (need more expertise in new fields), etc. All this creates unnecessary work for people with real jobs just because a boss wants it. In the end, the new director/c level can say, "wow, this was great, look at how our metrics have improved, all thanks to me!" Despite the fact that they weren't given all the features they were promised, or they didn't hire/train specialized engineers to truly own the new solution. Or maybe the solution isn't very effective. A lot of the time it's mostly politics. People are trying to get headlines just like politicians so they can keep climbing the ladder.

The way you're describing "bullshit" jobs doesn't exist, there are no jobs that are inherently, always bullshit. There's just bullshit work, and a lot of people who's job it is to do bullshit work

this post was submitted on 16 Aug 2023
156 points (97.0% liked)

No Stupid Questions

35295 readers
1330 users here now

No such thing. Ask away!

!nostupidquestions is a community dedicated to being helpful and answering each others' questions on various topics.

The rules for posting and commenting, besides the rules defined here for lemmy.world, are as follows:

Rules (interactive)


Rule 1- All posts must be legitimate questions. All post titles must include a question.

All posts must be legitimate questions, and all post titles must include a question. Questions that are joke or trolling questions, memes, song lyrics as title, etc. are not allowed here. See Rule 6 for all exceptions.



Rule 2- Your question subject cannot be illegal or NSFW material.

Your question subject cannot be illegal or NSFW material. You will be warned first, banned second.



Rule 3- Do not seek mental, medical and professional help here.

Do not seek mental, medical and professional help here. Breaking this rule will not get you or your post removed, but it will put you at risk, and possibly in danger.



Rule 4- No self promotion or upvote-farming of any kind.

That's it.



Rule 5- No baiting or sealioning or promoting an agenda.

Questions which, instead of being of an innocuous nature, are specifically intended (based on reports and in the opinion of our crack moderation team) to bait users into ideological wars on charged political topics will be removed and the authors warned - or banned - depending on severity.



Rule 6- Regarding META posts and joke questions.

Provided it is about the community itself, you may post non-question posts using the [META] tag on your post title.

On fridays, you are allowed to post meme and troll questions, on the condition that it's in text format only, and conforms with our other rules. These posts MUST include the [NSQ Friday] tag in their title.

If you post a serious question on friday and are looking only for legitimate answers, then please include the [Serious] tag on your post. Irrelevant replies will then be removed by moderators.



Rule 7- You can't intentionally annoy, mock, or harass other members.

If you intentionally annoy, mock, harass, or discriminate against any individual member, you will be removed.

Likewise, if you are a member, sympathiser or a resemblant of a movement that is known to largely hate, mock, discriminate against, and/or want to take lives of a group of people, and you were provably vocal about your hate, then you will be banned on sight.



Rule 8- All comments should try to stay relevant to their parent content.



Rule 9- Reposts from other platforms are not allowed.

Let everyone have their own content.



Rule 10- Majority of bots aren't allowed to participate here.



Credits

Our breathtaking icon was bestowed upon us by @Cevilia!

The greatest banner of all time: by @TheOneWithTheHair!

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS