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I recently decided to pick up Blackshirts & Reds and haven't been able to put it down. Throughout the book though, I notice Parenti can be quite scathing (for an ML) in his critiques about Stalin, he even throws a little shade at Lenin a few times. As someone who's not the most well versed in the weeds of Soviet history (Fitzpatrick's book is on my list), this caught me a bit off guard. B&R is unapologetically pro-Socialism but some of these critiques seem to be alternative to what I have heard about the the USSR. Forgive me for any historical ignorance, but Parenti's critique of 'war communism' and description of Stalin's USSR being under a "commandist, autocratic party leadership" are confusing to me to say the least. I was under the impression that the Soviet Union was actually quite democratic, even in Stalin's time. He also presents Lenin's desire to remove opposition from the party as a somewhat dramatic shift due to "[Bolshevik] siege psychology," going as far as to juxtapose it with when Lenin argued against Trotsky to give unions more autonomy. To me, this feels more like a criticism, or an attack on Lenin's methods. In returning to Stalin, he is presented as having to make a decision between autocracy or liberalization, the latter of the two, in his view, "would have produced a more comfortable, more humane and serviceable society" which may in fact be true, to me however this can almost read as a slight to the Soviet society of the future, but I digress from that topic as perhaps I truly am looking at Soviet society through rose tinted glasses. He continues to describe Stalin as a "supreme leader [with a personality cult] who claimed every revolutionary gain as his own achievement" and who "[suppressed the] party political life through terror."

Now I am certainly not saying these two are beyond criticism, far from it. Stalin and, yes, even Lenin should be ruthlessly criticized for their failings in order to maintain the ideological purity of Marxism-Leninism and to avoid deifying these two men. They are no doubt heroic comrades who fathered and grandfathered the ideology of Marxism-Leninism respectively, and played massive roles in the establishment of the first real Socialist experiment in the USSR. However, they are not some 'great men' who pushed forward history and thus can do no wrong.

With that aside, though, Parenti's perspective on Stalin in particular seems to be at odds with what I have heard. To my current knowledge, Stalin had times were he could be heavy handed, and no doubt he did make mistakes, sometimes quite egregious ones, but at the end of the day the material conditions surrounding the then one-of-a-kind society that was the USSR, and the nature of its constant besiegement by capitalist powers, justified the majority of his actions in the end. The man was a great leader, comrade, and pragmatist, but at the end of the day he was human, and imperfect. I was (and still am, until I am presented with valid alternative evidence) under the impression Stalin himself wasn't the power hungry, autocratic dictator he is often made out to be, and Parenti's interpretations to me read as though he believes Stalin was more of an autocrat than I once believed he was. If anyone could give me some more insight please let me know if I am missing something about Parenti's perspective, if he was truly more of an 'anti-Stalinist' type of socialist, or if I am simply mistaken on my interpretation of Parenti's words.

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Parenti was an American and used only English sources, anticommunism was all around him, naturally he did internalised some of it. Hell, even more scholarly and not American Domenico Losurdo in his book about Stalin few times just accept western "Stalin bad" assumptions without questioning them.

[–] cfgaussian@lemmygrad.ml 28 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago) (1 children)

Blackshirts and Reds is pro-socialist but with a noticeably liberal tinge to it in some parts. That's part of what makes it such an effective onboarding of new leftists to socialism and socialist history. It is not perfect, and Parenti himself, as much as we have to give him credit for resisting and seeing through the vast majority of anti-communist propaganda, was influenced by the prevailing view of the time and society he grew up and lived in as he wrote Blackshirts and Reds. I don't see this as taking anything away from the incredible value of that book for de-programming newcomers to the left out of a vast amount of anti-communist indoctrination. Parenti was and remains one of the most important socialist writers of the later half of the 20th century.

[–] FinnTheComrade@lemmygrad.ml 9 points 4 days ago (1 children)

I suppose I shouldn't have looked at it like it was going to be unapologetically pro-AES the same way that I understand the phrase today. The book is great for deprogramming newcomers from what I have seen so far: much more approachable language than most texts, well-sourced, and the opinions are most certainly easier to digest for a newcomer. Probably isn't the best for my experience to be reading this just after finishing Dialectical and Historical Materialism and while halfway through Left Wing Communism: An Infantile Disorder. I do like Parenti though, yellow Parenti's speech is an indispensable resource, and over all he seems to be an amazing author and orator to have in your deprogramming tool kit.

[–] LeninZedong@lemmygrad.ml 3 points 3 days ago (1 children)
[–] FinnTheComrade@lemmygrad.ml 4 points 3 days ago (1 children)

Yellow Parenti is the affectionate name given to Parenti's 1986 lecture given at the University of Colorado Boulder (or if you prefer the invidious link), a staunchly pro-AES, anti-imperialist lecture. The real name of the lecture is US Interventionism, the Third World, and the USSR (transcript). If there is someone who you are trying to sway from liberalism, who will be willing to consume in good faith, this is what you show them. Honestly, I would go as far as showing them this as nearly the first step in their deprogramming. It is almost a compressed version of B&R and is an excellent presentation of some of the gaping holes in the Western narrative. With how allergic most of the politically unenlightened are to reading, it's quite useful to have a 1.5 hour video that can really make people think with language that is extremely approachable.

[–] LeninZedong@lemmygrad.ml 1 points 2 days ago

It is a funny name haha (and thanks for the info :3).

[–] ComradeRat@hexbear.net 22 points 4 days ago (1 children)

People need to read more ML's critiques of the USSR imo, Stalin did his best but as you say he (and the rest of leadership) were merely human and constrained by material conditions

Molotov Remembers is a very good work. Its somewhere between auto/biography and retrospective look at the USSR. Molotov is extremely critical, not just of Khrushchev and subsequent leaders, but also himself, Stalin, Kaganovich etc the whole 20s-50s core leadership. Molotov himself here talks about distortions in party democracy, excesses in the purges and collectivisation campaigns, the theoretical failings of the leadership, and Stalin's increasingly bossy and eratic behaviours. Imo it should be a must-read for anyone studying the USSR

Sheila Fitzpatrick has some good works on the ussr during stalin's time. "On Stalin's Team" is her main work about the leadership itself. It talks about the shifts over time from the collective leadership to stalin being the leader, and then the renewal of collective leadership during ww2 and decline afterwards with stalins increasingly erratic behaviour. Largely she confirms what Molotov said, but provided receipts bc she had access to the archives.

[–] FinnTheComrade@lemmygrad.ml 9 points 4 days ago (1 children)

Added (both) to the reading list! Thank you for the recommendation comrade.

[–] ComradeRat@hexbear.net 18 points 4 days ago (1 children)

Always happy to share recommendations

These are some of the most interesting excerpts from Molotov Remembers imo (i've edited it to break up the paragraphs a bit for ease of reading):

Chuev, the interviewer asked Molotov:

"Is it true that after XIXth Congress [1952] Stalin said we had built a military-industrial dictatorship instead of socialism?"

Molotov replied:

He said something else. In private conversation he confessed that we no longer had a dictatorship of the proletariat. He didn't state this firmly, but he said it. Only to me. Perhaps he was testing me, or perhaps he was trying to understand something himself.

If you read our constitution thoroughly you will see that it contains many points which contradict the dictatorship of the proletariat. Of course, it's all said in a very transparent form. There is something like this: our Soviet power was born in 1917 as the dictatorship of the proletariat and became the power of all the toilers.

Notice, "all the toilers." That is why our country is administered by Soviets of Toilers' Deputies. Soviets have existed and remain, but they used to be Soviets of Workers', Soldiers', and Peasants' Deputies, fundamentally Soviets of Workers' and Peasants' Deputies. But this class division no longer exists. In my opinion this is a revision in diluted form: not the dictatorship of the proletariat but power of the toilers.


Molotov discusses the (lack of) theoretical talent in the party's leadership quite a bit:

"The Economic Problems of Socialism in the USSR" was discussed at Stalin's dacha. "Any questions, comrades? Have you read it?" He gathered together the members of the Politburo, some seven or eight people. "What do you think about it? Any comments?" We said something or other. I mentioned something not terribly important.

Now I confess, we underestimated the work. We should have gone into it more thoroughly. But no one as yet understood this. Unfortunately, people were bad at theory.

The more familiar I become with Stalin's "Economic Problems of Socialism," the more defects I find in it. I reread it today. How could he write: "It is obvious that after the disintegration of the world market, the spheres of exploitation of the world's resources by the major capitalist countries, the USA, Britain, and France, will contract, yet the cyclical character of the development of capitalism, the growth and contraction of production, will nevertheless be preserved." This is true. But further on-and this was written in 1952-"However, the growth of production in these countries will take place on a narrower base, because the volume of production in these countries will contract." But nothing of the kind has occurred.

Chuev asked: Was Khrushchev adept in matters of theory?

No. He was extremely weak in that regard. We were all "practicals , " all practitioners. Before the Revolution we read all the books and newspapers, now we read nothing. Had I not spent so long in prison and exile, I wouldn't know many things either! I read publications written by our opponents too, and we had to participate in heated discussions.


This excerpt also has Molotov arguing not just that socialism hadnt triumphed completely in the USSR but also that the position/formulation 'the USSR is socialist; socialism has been achieved in the USSR' is simplistic and contrary to marxism-leninism (bold text is Chuev's context):

Khrushchev gathered writers together one day at Stalin's remote dacha, two hundred kilometers from Moscow. There he announced for all to hear that he had differences of opinion with me. His move particularly displeased me because he announced it at a nonparty gathering. It all started with an article in the journal Kommunist in 1955, where I argued that we had constructed only the foundations of socialism in our country. Shortly before that I had gathered reporters and distributed the article to them. There were some queries on the article. But I said I believed that socialism in our country was not yet complete

Under Khrushchev, Molotov was reproached for saying that in our country, only the "basis of socialism" had been constructed and not "socialism basically, " and he confessed his mistake in the journal of the Central Committee, Kommunist.

No, I had to. They forced me to. At a session of the Supreme Soviet I delivered a report on the international situation. By the way, I still believe that both conclusions were correct. Then, a letter signed by Pospelov and Rumiantsev was published. They contended that "socialism basically" and its "basis" had been built long ago. I then said at the Politburo: "I don't see any contradiction in terms there. One can say that both "socialism basically" and "basis" have been built. "Basis" is a narrower concept, which places greater emphasis on the economic side of things. "Basis" or "basically"-just so much talmudic hairsplitting. I wrote that both formulations were correct, consequently there could be no objections to my position as being incorrect, because "basis" is the same as "basically." To see a difference between the two one would have to be a pedant.

At that time Khrushchev started undermining you.

Why started? He had always been doing that.

They seem to have been eager to incriminate you somehow. They launched a campaign against you.

Not just over some issue or another. Not just any issue. This question was absolutely crucial. To say that socialism had triumphed completely and definitely was to oversimplify our achievements, and this contradicted Marxism-Leninism. No one wants to dig into this now, but exasperation with this situation is sure to mount. Younger people will take up the issue and agree that the wrong conclusion had been drawn. ...

Another of the interviewers, Ivanovich, said:

"We have brought an end to class struggle,"

We have not yet brought an end to anything.

Within the country.

Even within the country we have brought nothing to an end. We have only laid the foundations.

Khrushchev said we have completed the edifice.

It was not completed under Khrushchev, and it is still not completed. Quite the contrary, the ideology contained in the party program only hampers progress.

Good heavens! The program is incorrect!

Not just incorrect, it impedes the building of socialism. The workers toil and move the cause forward; the peasants, kolkhozniki, work slowly but are advancing. They lack genuine leadership. In reality the people are preoccupied with problems of daily life. A socialism in which money dominates is not the socialism of Marx, Engels, and Lenin. There is no such socialism. Just try to find it. Yet in our country such "socialism" exists. There is no genuine socialism in which two kinds of property exist, neither in Marx, Engels, and Lenin nor in a developed, completely built socialism. Instead of overcoming these vestiges of the transitional period, we have preserved them and applied the brakes to further progress. And we claim we are already building communism. It's absurd. That's what this ideology leads to.

In "Economic Problems of Socialism, " didn't Stalin address this problem correctly?

Correctly. He started off cautiously, but in the end he took a firm position. He alone addressed the question correctly. We didn't understand all of it back then. He made some mistakes, and I called them to his attention. He let me read the manuscript of a part which was then published, and the second part on which he was still working. But I repeat: there is nothing in Marx, Engels, and Lenin to suggest that you can have socialism while money, the purse, holds sway.

The kolkhoz is a transitional, and only a transitional, form. No socialism, no complete socialism, exists while there are two forms of property, state and cooperative. Yet we say that we have a developed socialist society, delude ourselves in this manner when in fact we are slamming on the brakes. We must liquidate this delusion and unleash the full energy of the people. This step will turn things white-hot but will work itself out.

Nevertheless, our present leadership [under Brezhnev and Kosygin] doesn't understand this, while those who slip them ineffectual memoranda are simply mindless, petty bourgeois ideologists. We have only built the foundations; true, this is irreversible. But lo and behold, they proclaim: "This is developed socialism! Let us pass on to communism!" and so forth. We are passing on to nothing.

Look, Brezhnev, in spite of himself, is one of those leaders who doesn't understand this, one of those who live according to a vulgar, petty bourgeois ideology. We have a lot of that around in our country, and it cannot but impede progress. Most interesting is the fact that you won't find any serious people pondering this problem. Have you heard of anyone who says that we must somehow change so as to build the socialism of Marx, Engels, and Lenin? You won't find such a person.

[–] shreditdude0@lemmygrad.ml 3 points 3 days ago (1 children)

I gotta start reading this book today. Fuck, man, reading these excerpts was heartbreaking, but extremely elucidating.

[–] ComradeRat@hexbear.net 7 points 3 days ago

Yeah its a very cool book. It has a nice balance between defence of the ussr against liberalbrained criticism, but also acknowledgement of the shortcomings and ruthless criticism of anything standing in the way of fixing those issues

Molotovs also a good person to hear it from, because you know he isnt just some ultraleft westerner raving about how the ussr isnt real socialism, molotov himself saying "the ussr hasnt achieved socialism and saying it did so is harmful to actually achieving socialism" has much more weight to it

Molotov pretty much spent the rest of his life once he was kicked out of politics trying to figure out where things went wrong, and he's honest enough to admit that the leadership (including him) helped create the problems (in contrast to khrushchev blaming everything on Stalin). Molotov was writing letters to the Central Committee begging them to let him back in and to fix shit basically until he died, but was ignored. Poor guy

[–] Commiejones@lemmygrad.ml 18 points 4 days ago

I do think there is plenty of room to criticize the USSR and Stalin but I don't think Parenti had the information required to do so effectively.

Stalin's leadership skills were formed by WW2. He knew it and tried to get out because he could see the problems involved with having warriors try to build a society. Unfortunately there was no civilian leader ready and strong enough to take up the mantle. By the time he died the problems were baked in and the new leadership tried to just blame everything on him while not fixing the problems.

[–] opiumfree@lemmygrad.ml 18 points 4 days ago (1 children)

my 2 cents is that older communists in general will have different opinions than us on the USSR and other socialist states because they lived through these world events, saw things in a way we cant, were exposed to the propaganda of that time, have nationalistic reasoning etc.

a week or two ago a chinese comrade made a post on how some ML in china have a more negative opinion on russia and iran and used a very old influencer as an example, but this was someone who lived through the sino soviet split personally and was impacted by it and had a reason to be biased.

parenti was 12 when WW2 ended and spent his life in the US during the cold war. he experienced the red scare and state narratives of the US and nuclear drills and that affected his perception on things. the book was released in 1997 and he didnt glaze stalin because that was not the historical context back then and it was not how people approached it.

for a bit of context: im from a post socialist state and came across a 1966 edition of ”lust for life”. in the introduction, it frames irving stone as being part of the very suppressed american socialist scene, that he spent his time with workers movements and that he was dedicated to the radicals of america. this is not true and irving stone was a liberal.

[–] FinnTheComrade@lemmygrad.ml 13 points 4 days ago (1 children)

This is probably the more accurate way to look at the situation. Older communists—especially those who lived through the red scare—will, unfortunately always be marred by the material conditions of their time, in some way shape or form, in the formulation of many of their opinions. In more extreme examples of it than Parenti, Marx and Stalin were products of their time in many ways, it will likely happen to many of us in the future (the most obvious thing I see being a 'Stalin was homophobic' or a 'Marx was antisemetic' of the future will be 'FinnTheComrade ate factory farmed meat' lol).

Side not: how do you figure that Irving Stone thing even happened? Was it not historical context of the time for Communists and Liberals to be mortal enemies like they are now? Interesting.

[–] opiumfree@lemmygrad.ml 8 points 4 days ago

my theory about the irving stone was that they had to lie a bit to get the book released so they framed its contents and author in a wayyy more revolutionary manner